Snapped Frame/Motor mount. Weld, replace, or sell?

[OG MayMay]

About a month ago I bought a 2006 fz6. Looked great, rode great, i checked oil, forks, air filter, etc all before buying. Everything checked out. I even checked the frame for cracks because I knew about the issue with frame sliders snapping the frame. The only explanation I can come up with for missing this was the split and condition of the bracket that was fabricated was a lot better when i looked at it and/or it was a little to dark to see it, it was about 8 oclock pm when i checked it out.

Anyways the frame/motor stress member mount that bolts into the motor is snapped on the right side of the bike, and I've been riding for a month no problems every day and just realized it today upon closer inspection. This isn't my first bike and ive been riding motorcycles and working on them since i was little. Ive attached pictures, should i replace the frame, weld it, or just sell it for a loss as totaled?

Ive called around a couple experienced welders in the area that come to you and they said they could do it if i strip the frame down.

Ive attached pics of it.

What do you guys think i should do?

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B9irZkuRbW84SmEwcHRGXy1PcFk
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B9irZkuRbW84aDUxSTctcXk2SDg
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B9irZkuRbW84d0QyeW5iYzJYelE

 

[OG MayMay]

Snapped right side frame/motor mount

About a month ago I bought a 2006 fz6. Looked great, rode great, i checked oil, forks, air filter, etc all before buying. Everything checked out. I even checked the frame for cracks because I knew about the issue with frame sliders snapping the frame. The only explanation I can come up with for missing this was the split and condition of the bracket that was fabricated was a lot better when i looked at it and/or it was a little to dark to see it, it was about 8 oclock pm when i checked it out.

Anyways the frame/motor stress member mount that bolts into the motor is snapped on the right side of the bike, and I've been riding for a month no problems every day and just realized it today upon closer inspection. This isn't my first bike and ive been riding motorcycles and working on them since i was little. Ive attached pictures, should i replace the frame, weld it, or just sell it for a loss as totaled?

Ive called around a couple experienced welders in the area that come to you and they said they could do it if i strip the frame down.

Ive attached pics of it.

What do you guys think i should do?

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B9irZkuRbW84SmEwcHRGXy1PcFk
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B9irZkuRbW84aDUxSTctcXk2SDg
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B9irZkuRbW84d0QyeW5iYzJYelE

 

[FinalImpact]

Hi and welcome. I'm not going to say what you should do. More what you could do.

Loosen all engine mounts and remove all bolts Except the long one above the transmission. Leave it in. You will have scissor jack under the header.

The goal: jack the engine in a manor that allows the long bolt through the trans to spin with finger effort. No binding. No strain.

Your next goal is to see that ALL other bolts easily slip into their holes and center not touching the frame.

If all of the bolts center in the frame it could mean the frame is not stressed and simply has a corner torn off.
If this is true - strip it and weld it.

If they do Not or can not be made to align, it's a good indication the frame is stressed. Welding a stressed frame and subjecting it to vibrations will likely lead to it breaking someplace else. Scrap it if the bolts can not be aligned without freely entering the mounting points.

Does that make sense?

Is that supposed to be May Day, May Day....

 

[IanHoots]

Re: Snapped right side frame/motor mount

Welding alloy can usually be a success with experience and careful prep work. It would usually write off a bike of this age, as the cost of paying someone to strip the bike down to do the repair can be quite high. If you can do the R&R work yourself the cost will be reasonable.

Do you have any recourse through where you bought it? Was it through a business that you could lobby to get you money back or repair it? It was only month ago.

Personally I would check with your insurance company to see if you can squeeze them for coverage. Or damage it further and then claim, bikes get written off all the time.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Re: Snapped right side frame/motor mount

Agreed with both above posts.

Just to add, that very end of the frame(arm), will need to be built up with some time grinding back down to stock and harder yet, opening up the inside of the hole(where the bolt goes thru) which will take some time and very careful grinding, probably with a dremel..

With that said, one member (chevyfazer) here broke his frame (in a different area). Instead of dissembling the entire bike, he supported the engine, wheels, etc

Once supported he literally un-bolted BOTH halves of the frame (bike still pretty much assembled) and then welded with the entire half of the frame at hand. That'd be much easier for the welder as well as re-grinding down.

Do a search on him, his post.

BTW, is there any other evidence (and how bad) of a slide / tip over, (ie tank damage, bent fairing stay, busted side mole, scuffed passenger handles etc).
The one pic posted looked like it was very off. I probably wouldn't ride it anymore as that is the ONLY RS engine mount besides the two rear thru bolts...

I'd probably lean towards another frame...

Good luck.

 

[OG MayMay]

Thanks for the info, I took that fabricated bracket off and it looks like it could easily be welded back on, it was a clean break. And it snapped before the hole for the bolt as well, I will most def check all the other bolts for correct alignment.
Also I only have liability insurance so theres no help there.

I can strip the bike down to the frame myself, then i will take it in to get welded by someone experienced
Thanks for everyone's help

 

[FinalImpact]

I forgot about the one side frame removal. The only headache there is the head bearings. A good time to replace them with tapered rollers....

The break looks to be isolated. Have you verified the engine threads are still robust enough to handle the proper bolt torque?

PS I merged your threads. One will do if there is no new information. Just give it some time.

 

[motojoe122]

Just a couple pennies more....
Take LOTS of pictures as you disassemble, make progress, and re assemble. It will save you in the end. I'm guilty of not doing it[emoji19]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Puttin Along]

I good welder/fabricator could find a way to weld it in place. Where there is a will there is a way! Find someone who is creative and can TIG! Beef it up and support the weld with another bracket kinda like what was on there, only weld it in place!

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

I good welder/fabricator could find a way to weld it in place. Where there is a will there is a way! Find someone who is creative and can TIG! Beef it up and support the weld with another bracket kinda like what was on there, only weld it in place!

The original should be "v"ed out so the weld has full penetration, then trimmed / filed down to look stock.

We used to do odd TIG welding and things lkike that all the time when I worked in a machine shop many moons ago.
I did the prep work and final clean up, the boss did the TIG welding itself..

 

[FinalImpact]

Yes, a good tig operator could tig in place. However the amount of material that must be ground away, filled, and then machined makes it not worth it IMO.

Adding to that the shear amount of heat induced by such a large fillet is another concern and the resolution is time. As in let it cool after every pass.
Point - a welders time is money. It will cost you more too do it while assembled than if taken apart.

Also do not introduce any foreign material to the parts to be welded. Dont use an old steel file full of copper, brass, steel or anything like that. Impurities like paint and solvents only make it harder to weld.

When removing paint grind in a manor such that paint is taken away from the repair site vs forced into it.

Good luck what ever you decide to do!

 

[OG MayMay]

Update:

Been busy with work so I haven't been able to work on my bike. Taking it apart tomorrow. Tonight I am gonna do some more research on Chevyfazer"s method of taking the frame off.

Possible streetfigher build coming, but i don't know if i wanna put that much money into it. Currently on the fence between keeping after the fix, or selling and getting a fz-9. But I guess we will see after its all put back together.

As for the welding side, my friends grandpa used to race funny cars back in the day and worked for chrysler to help redesign the hemi, he said he knows someone he used to work with that can do it for a case of beer and it will be better than new. It was kinda funny because he immediately starting talking **** about Japanese cast aluminum, but said it was a beautiful bike.

 

[FinalImpact]

I fitted an S1 header to an S2 chassis which involved grinding off a protrusion from the S2 oil sump and TIG welding a hole making the sump flush over a quarter sized area and it went well. The filler rod was generic aluminum rod, and it did initially make some gas holes.
I'm just saying, give it a shot.

Keep it clean and try not to mix any foreign material in while prepping work area!
Good luck!

 

[OG MayMay]

Update: bikes back together after the weld and so far she rides good.

What they ended up doing was adding a bit of alumunim behind the outside surface of the frame and essentially made it a rounded solid frame, not just a hollow cut out. They did this for about an inch after the hole because the aluminum that kept the hole intact was too thin. They then drilled out the hole. All for free, I couldn't be more thankful. And it was done in a professional car customs shop.

As for the fate of the fz-6, it's not so bright. When I took the half of the frame off of my bike that I needed, I notice that the motor was cracked around a mounting point. Its in a secluded spot and even if it completely seperated, no oil would leak. I'm assuming it's from the motor being unsupported on that side from where the frame snapped. I plan on taking the motor out this winter and welding it and posting on craigslist. And then get an fz-09

 

[OG MayMay]

Also one pipe of my exhaust manifold is dented a few times on the second bend. This caused fitment issues when putting the header back on, I eventually heated it up with map gas, stuck a steel pipe in it and bent it slightly, this allowed them to fit just barely, and I didn't want to bend it again. I had to slowly tap them in with a rubber mallet and a piece of wood under the headers.

Any advice on what to do next time? I tried sanding a bit of the carbon build up around the outside of the pipes.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Its assembled now so a pic wouldn't help.

A larger O2 acetylene torch heating around the entire tube where its bent should take care of it.

Getting it about red hot would get it moving.

**If you know where the bend is right now, (protect the engine with some sheet metal) and heat the header
up (red hot completely around) while installed.

When it AIR cools, it should pretty much stay where its at W/O wrestling with it.



*As for the cracked block, it most likely broke from the initial damage. The bolt took out the frame, then chipped off the engine block.

The damage / initial crack is very unusual especially for NOT having frame sliders. You took a VERY HARD hit in that spot....

 

[FinalImpact]

A straight edge across the pipes should in both planes should tell you which way to go. Then measure the spacing. An option is to apply pressure and strike the tube needing bent to relieve stress. Heat is an option or used fleebay header.

Grabbed an S1 for $35 shipped and installed on S2 bike..

Cleaned up pretty nice too.

IMG]http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h305/73sport/FZ6%20%202008/BoltOns/IMG_20150120_154129_948_zps10bac8de.jpg[/IMG]

 

[ChevyFazer]

Brings back memories of ripping a frame apart

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

He's baaaaaack! ^^^^^^ :rockon:

 

[FinalImpact]

OP one question: was the frame horn resting on the block or did the bolt have to pull it in (close the gap).

If there was a gap I would suggest you remove the bolt and fill the gap with shim stock. The reason is stress and tension can create another crack elsewhere... releive the tension...