Help on Rebuilding Calipers and finding the Yamaha Star shaped socket for the caliper

[trepetti]

Thanks everyone for your help! I'm currently finishing up my forks and then swingarm service and brakes will be next after that!

@trepetti No way!! Where at??

Most of the family grew up on Fowler Ave in the Morris Park section. I was born there but the family moved to NJ when I was 9 months old. I still identify with the old neighborhood, where we played stickball (how many sewas can you hit the ball) and played stoop ball whenever we got a new 'Spaldeen'. Everyone has left by now, but I still rib my cousins for pronouncing it 'The Bvronx'.

 

[bigborer]

If I don't buy the motion pro tool, am totally trying this next time. The downside of the grease gun method, while sure-fire, is the aftermath cleanup in all the nooks n crannies.

Another downside is destroying the seals. Most times, even with stuck pistons the seals are reusable at least for a short while. Put some grease on them and... I wouldn't wanna ride that bike.

 

[gnyce]

Another downside is destroying the seals. Most times, even with stuck pistons the seals are reusable at least for a short while. Put some grease on them and... I wouldn't wanna ride that bike.

True, but if I'm doing that (grease gun), I already know I'm replacing the seals.

 

[trepetti]

Another downside is destroying the seals. Most times, even with stuck pistons the seals are reusable at least for a short while. Put some grease on them and... I wouldn't wanna ride that bike.

Gotta tell you...... I would never reuse caliper seals. If the caliper has to come apart it gets put together with fresh kit.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Question,

How do you get your grease gun to hold tight enough on the caliper to pump grease (especially at high pressure)?

There's no threads between chambers, just hand pressure?



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[bigborer]

You screw something like this one end into the grease gun the other into where the brake line bolt is

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

You screw something like this one end into the grease gun the other into where the brake line bolt is

Ok, so all pistons do have to be in place and your flexible grease gun line HAS TO HAVE the exact same threads (that is very possibly an issue).

Me thinks I like your other method, the "socket and 90 degree needle nose"..
(Fortunately, I'm not needing new seals anytime soon but would like to try that)..

.

 

[bigborer]

If you take a "regular" grease gun flexible attachment, a part that likely comes with any grease gun, and unscrew the rounded bit you are left with something that looks like the pic from my previous post- a thread matching most calipers. I think it's NPT 1/4" or 1/8", but don't quote me on this.

The main issue isn't the threads, it's the mess caused by all that grease. Last time it took me over an hour, one skewer stick, one paper towel roll and two cans of part cleaner spray, plus some extra paper towels and dish detergent for the work area, to clean all the mess. And yes, all pistons need to be in. If this was the only option on earth I'd rather just weld a small rod or cheap socket to the piston, or order a "new" low milage caliper. But thankfully it's not the only method.

You don't have to need new seals to take out the pistons, I do it every time I replace the brake pads. The thinner the pads get the more the pistons stay out, and the more they stay out the more dirt they collect. When you push them in for the new pads you also push that dirty surface in, resulting in stuck pistons and worn out seals. Quality made in Japan seals such as the OEM ones should last a really long time if the brakes are serviced regularly.

 

[trepetti]

If you take a "regular" grease gun flexible attachment, a part that likely comes with any grease gun, and unscrew the rounded bit you are left with something that looks like the pic from my previous post- a thread matching most calipers. I think it's NPT 1/4" or 1/8", but don't quote me on this.

The main issue isn't the threads, it's the mess caused by all that grease. Last time it took me over an hour, one skewer stick, one paper towel roll and two cans of part cleaner spray, plus some extra paper towels and dish detergent for the work area, to clean all the mess. And yes, all pistons need to be in. If this was the only option on earth I'd rather just weld a small rod or cheap socket to the piston, or order a "new" low milage caliper. But thankfully it's not the only method.

You don't have to need new seals to take out the pistons, I do it every time I replace the brake pads. The thinner the pads get the more the pistons stay out, and the more they stay out the more dirt they collect. When you push them in for the new pads you also push that dirty surface in, resulting in stuck pistons and worn out seals. Quality made in Japan seals such as the OEM ones should last a really long time if the brakes are serviced regularly.

Interesting, you remove the pistons for a cleaning for each pad change? I have been cleaning the exposed piston surfaces before I press them back into their bore. Figured it would yield the same result without the additional risk of damaging the seals.

 

[Gary in NJ]

After reading all of this, I’m quite sure that the Motion Pro tool is a great value.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Interesting, you remove the pistons for a cleaning for each pad change? I have been cleaning the exposed piston surfaces before I press them back into their bore. Figured it would yield the same result without the additional risk of damaging the seals.

Agreed 100% ^^. Pulling pistons for every pad change is overkill unless excessive, horrible conditions exist.

I do pump the pistons out a bit more (NOT breaking the seal) for proper cleaning. You may have to "block off" a piston or two to access all equally.

Besides brake cleaner for the heavy crud, what I found to work best cleaning pistons is what I use to clean my header, "Mothers metal cleaner". That and a cloth (un-less pitted) will bring a piston back to new condition..

Also, per the Yamaha manual, is to never re-use seals...

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Also, not noted in this thread, per the Yamaha manual, brake seals should be replaced EVERY TWO YEARS... I think that's a bit over kill, maybe many miles per year in crappy conditions..

 

[bigborer]

Interesting, you remove the pistons for a cleaning for each pad change? I have been cleaning the exposed piston surfaces before I press them back into their bore. Figured it would yield the same result without the additional risk of damaging the seals.

Once you cleaned the pistons and seals there is no risk of damage. I also give them a very thin (as thin as possible) coat of "rubber seal grease". This is a debated topic, as far as I recall the manual says to coat them with brake fluid.

After reading all of this, I’m quite sure that the Motion Pro tool is a great value.

As described in post #16, there's no need for any tool or any kind of mess.

brake cleaner for the heavy crud

If the brake cleaner touches the seals, that's much more damage than any reinsertion of caliper pistons.

And just to clarify- the seals should never be removed and reinserted. Cleaning them with a damp paper towel by rotating it around their ID (no up and down motions as it would likely damage the lips of the seals) is more than enough.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Agreed, brake cleaner on the seals is NOT good (see below). Brake cleaner applied via rag, toothbrush, etc, on an exposed, pushed out piston (not near the seals) won't hurt anything.

I've also learned brake grease, applied on the seals just attracts dirt.

More importantly, a good seal (soft/pliable) is what pulls the piston back, IE
with even a little brake grease on the seals, the seals won't pull the piston back, the lube lets them "slip" (not the correct verbiage) and not retract the piston..




From the shop manual:

 

[Gary in NJ]

Hmmm, every two years you say. I tend to update the fluid every 4-5 years...maybe that’s a better interval. I know it’s suggested that the fluid be changed every 2 years as well, but I find that interval is too often.

 

[gnyce]

Question,

How do you get your grease gun to hold tight enough on the caliper to pump grease (especially at high pressure)?

There's no threads between chambers, just hand pressure?
.

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Not sure where I read about this, but works like a charm in clipping onto it with the grease gun. I probably should have specified - I did _not_ do this when changing the FZ6 seals (and installing SS brake lines), but I had to use with the FZR1000, Nighthawk, and the Maxim fixup-projects - e.g. not normal/scheduled maintenance.

I'll order the Motion Pro tool later this Spring...

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Obviously a zerk fitting would work although I don't remember the port holes being that large.

I wouldn't be thrilled about drilling them open, then thread an NPT for them to fit.
I guess if it it WOULDN'T come out, that'd be a last resort.

For me, I have an air compressor(two actually) and it wouldn't (wasn't) be an issue.


Kinda like that tool but don't do enough brake work to have one collecting dust...

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[trepetti]

Obviously a zerk fitting would work although I don't remember the port holes being that large.

I wouldn't be thrilled about drilling them open, then thread an NPT for them to fit.
I guess if it it WOULDN'T come out, that'd be a last resort.

For me, I have an air compressor(two actually) and it wouldn't (wasn't) be an issue.


Kinda like that tool but don't do enough brake work to have one collecting dust...

.

Yep, so the value is simple. If you have nothing and need to do seals, the tool is the cheapest, fastest and easiest way to proceed. If you have a compressor or a grease gun, the tool is only the easiest and fastest.

 

[TheKB]

Just as an FYI, when the seals get old, they harden up and drag.

Mine after the new seals installed:

https://flic.kr/p/24gHvHC

Looks like I have to do front and back calipers.
During the winter I changed my sprockets, chain and lubed and cleaned my swing arm. After I put everything back together I noticed the rear break chafing to the break pad even though I think I aligned everything correctly. I have no idea when the seals were changed on my 2007 S2, so that's probably it.
Doing the free wheel spin test (without chain) using bit less force than in the video the rear wheel does 2 full rotations and the front wheel does one so seems like the front is even worse off.

I'll probably drive mine to the mechanic for them to do the breaks. Seems like a messy job that needs specific tools that I don't have and job that I'll likely screw up.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Two full turns on the rear isn't bad at all.

The front, has 4 pistons on each side, 8 total, so lots of rubber to harden up.

Might wanna think about stainless steel lines as the system will be dry and need bleeding anyway...

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[TheKB]

What about the chafing though? In the video and on my bike (both wheels) I hear the chafing (sound is even all the way, doesn't start and stop so shouldn't be warped brake wheels), like the pads are rubbing against the break wheel. That's what got me worried from the start that the break isn't retracting all the way.