So the President can fire the CEO of Corporations now?

[wrightme43]

How bout them apples????


Doesnt that smack of dictatorial behavior? Are shareholder meetings a moot point now? Does all voting stock now become non voting stock if the owners vote doesnt jive with the Presidents position???



I have to say Mussolini and Castro both had more tack than this fruit loop.

 

[08fz6]

to be honest they needed a bail out so they weren't doing something right.... not to mention the millions they made to ruin a buisness....

 

[DaveOTZ]

How bout them apples????


Doesnt that smack of dictatorial behavior? Are shareholder meetings a moot point now? Does all voting stock now become non voting stock if the owners vote doesnt jive with the Presidents position???



I have to say Mussolini and Castro both had more tack than this fruit loop.

I totally see your point... but... We have become a capitalistic aristocracy where renumeration isn't based on merit...

I say we don't bail em out at all...

 

[08fz6]

i think the ceo's and all other management should take a substantial pay cut and problem solved....

 

[tom5796]

i think the ceo's and all other management should take a substantial pay cut and problem solved....

You will find bad apples in any bushel... and they'll be the ones to get the headlines. But most are some of the most intelligent folks you'll find (my ceo included). The minute you introduce a forced subsidy is the moment they leave, and we'll all suffer for it. Sorry, but we're not all born/bred/shaped to the same standard.

I personally feel that Wagoner's hands were tied. And this is nothing more than Chavez in a "kinder," more political light. Let them fail, but let them emerge stronger without the union/pension/political strings attached.

 

[wrightme43]

Thats the thing.

Its not the president, congress, senate, treasury, fed, or any Governmental Org that has any legal control over the CEO of any corp. in the USA.

The only governments that can decide the Head of a company are dictatorships.

Chavez, Kim Ill, Obama???? WTF is up with this guys. The president doesnt get to fire the CEO of companies.


I am 100% against any bailouts, but they still dont get to decide who runs the company.

 

[Hellgate]

I was thinking the exact same thing Steve. I'm no Wagoner fan and he has been moving at a sub-snails pace, no urgency what so ever, but this seems out of line to me. If Obama doesn't want to give them any more money fine, but to demand him to step down is a completely different angle.

Now on the flip side I think bankruptcy for GM will not be a bad thing. Stay with me...GM has some excellent product that is hidden among some crap. In bankruptcy the crap can be removed and the good products will really shine.

Examples of good products; Chevy and GMC pick ups, Chevy Malibu, Pontiac G8, Corvette, Acadia,and I hate to say it, most Bu-icks. They need to drop cars such as the HHR, SaaB, Hummer, Saturn, the Cadillac pick up, and other legacy platform cars (older Pontiacs, etc). Oh and fire most of the American designers....

What really amazes me is that while GM is much better than they were 10 to 15 years ago, Wagoner never wanted to make any bold and broad changes. His changes were very incremental but never fully transformed the company.

 

[wrightme43]

I was thinking the exact same thing Steve. I'm no Wagoner fan and he has been moving at a sub-snails pace, no urgency what so ever, but this seems out of line to me. If Obama doesn't want to give them any more money fine, but to demand him to step down is a completely different angle.

Now on the flip side I think bankruptcy for GM will not be a bad thing. Stay with me...GM has some excellent product that is hidden among some crap. In bankruptcy the crap can be removed and the good products will really shine.

Examples of good products; Chevy and GMC pick ups, Chevy Malibu, Pontiac G8, Corvette, Acadia,and I hate to say it, most Bu-icks. They need to drop cars such as the HHR, SaaB, Hummer, Saturn, the Cadillac pick up, and other legacy platform cars (older Pontiacs, etc). Oh and fire most of the American designers....

What really amazes me is that while GM is much better than they were 10 to 15 years ago, Wagoner never wanted to make any bold and broad changes. His changes were very incremental but never fully transformed the company.

Thats exactly it man. The only way to fix this country is to remove the bad debt and bad products that are being counted at par on balance sheets.

Everybody knows they are worth 30cent on the dollar but they are being shown at par.

Bancruptcy is the only effective way to move debt than can not be paid. This hide the rotten salami game they are playing with our finacial market has got to stop, but firing the CEO of company because he caused Obama to lose face is pure dictatorial behavior. That is not Obamas choice. That is the shareholders choice.

Can he now just go in right a check with our money (that doesnt exist) (that we were 300/1 against) and fire the CEO of HP? maybe he doesnt like how the manager at dairy queen is running the place?

 

[githianki]

My worry is that if they do file for bakruptcy or restructure is what is going to happen to the little guy that supplies GM and Chrysler. The tier one and two suppliers may be OK..but the little tier-3 guy might not make it. GM gets almost 80% of its parts from those little suppliers. So imagine the 140k of people directly employed by GM, and add in another 80-100k of people who work for them in the supply chain, and it will spiral down. If something happens (and I do hope they restructure and tell the unions to go pound sand) they have to include the little guys in there too.

 

[LERecords]

this was going to happen either way.. wagner had to step down because people lost so much trust in GM that they only way to help build it back is to ditch the CEO.. you'll see alot of these business ditching their ceo and then crying, well it was his fault... i really don think that obama forced anyone to quit.. oh and wasnt it the car companies that came crying to the govt with their hands out... of course some poeple are going to have to take the kit, thats the whole idea of a restructure..

as for the parts suppliers, same thing, some of you are going under, some of you are not. plain and simple that we just have too many jobs in an industry that can not support it.. so those people will be looking for new work soon to.. and to those that think im crazzy and say, well no that cant happen.. if you dont do it now, you'll end up doing it later because we just dont need that many part suppliers.. same as we dont need 25 different brands of cars and trucks...

oh and on the flip side of the govt.. why didnt we ever rise up and demand a stop to the war in iraq.. i dont think the war had much popular support.. or rise up and remove bush for lying to the country among other things.. his popularity was what 20%.. everyone just needs to relax.. i know its a scary time and things dont look good, but this is america and we will work through it.. im sure the people in the depression era never thought it would end, but it did and look at all the great things we accomplished.. $h!t happens.. deal with it..

 

[Cuba]

What they should have done is force out the union bosses that are bankrupting these companies. If the federal government can now restructure legal private contracts at will then they can simply restructure the union contracts strangling these manufacturers. We all know that is the issue here, not the CEO with his hands tied. It was laughable when Obama said the reason these companies are in trouble is because they were making SUVs instead of priuses, that's what people buy!! The only reason Japanese car manufacturers in the US are profitable is because they don't pay 780K people to not work.

That being said you are totally right, this is a terrifying beginning to full government control of production in this country. When will the tide turn? When will the public wake the f*ck up??

 

[Hellgate]

So this weekend Obama's aides blamed the auto industry problems on Bush. Give me a break. These guys are clueless.

 

[wrightme43]

this was going to happen either way.. wagner had to step down because people lost so much trust in GM that they only way to help build it back is to ditch the CEO.. you'll see alot of these business ditching their ceo and then crying, well it was his fault... i really don think that obama forced anyone to quit.. oh and wasnt it the car companies that came crying to the govt with their hands out... of course some poeple are going to have to take the kit, thats the whole idea of a restructure..

as for the parts suppliers, same thing, some of you are going under, some of you are not. plain and simple that we just have too many jobs in an industry that can not support it.. so those people will be looking for new work soon to.. and to those that think im crazzy and say, well no that cant happen.. if you dont do it now, you'll end up doing it later because we just dont need that many part suppliers.. same as we dont need 25 different brands of cars and trucks...

oh and on the flip side of the govt.. why didnt we ever rise up and demand a stop to the war in iraq.. i dont think the war had much popular support.. or rise up and remove bush for lying to the country among other things.. his popularity was what 20%.. everyone just needs to relax.. i know its a scary time and things dont look good, but this is america and we will work through it.. im sure the people in the depression era never thought it would end, but it did and look at all the great things we accomplished.. $h!t happens.. deal with it..

So you feel that the President can force the removal of CEOs of companies, rewrite contracts at will, and determine the number of car manufactures in the US?

In my opinion these ideas are well prepared for socialism, and seem to be supporting it. The news says Obama forced Wagoner to resign as a condition of funds. That shoots the whole you dont think he did thing down.

We need to relax? In less than 100 days of power they have completly invalidated all contract law in the US, raised our debt load to the GNP of the whole entire world, funneled billions illegally and with the express consent of the fed and treasury to foriegn banks, and the dude giggles like a school girl on tv.

I dont think relaxing is called for.

On the Iraq war issue I believe that would belong in another thread.

 

[LERecords]

i dont think govt should be involved with it, but the car companies came the the party begging, got what they would consider "free money" and it had rules tied to it.. gm didnt do what they were required to do, so thus this happened..

but i would like to hear your side.. i really want to know what you think we should do about it.. i asume you must be a republican.. not a dig on you, just making an asumption.. but i would like to know what you think we should do about it.. should we all rise up and take over power.. kick the govt to the curb.. then what.. i just dont think most people who say things liek this think the whole thing through.. do you know how much the govt is responsible for all sorts of things around the country and world.. do you know how it has its hand in alot of things.. i agree it should back off on stuff, but you can just stop things dead in their tract without severe consequenses.. but let me know.. i am always willing to listen to others about their idea's...

 

[wrightme43]

I have to leave now, I will be back later and I promise to answer your question as best I can.

England ran the United States untill we rose up against her. Its worked before, India thru off England and survived, Democracy got a foot hold in Russia and is now failing. We have every right to peaceably assemble in Washington DC and allow no normal commerce or lawmaking to take place untill our grievences are redressed, we have every right to fire every single government official and start over. We even have the right to violently over throw our government and institute a new one. These are not constitional rights. These are basic human rights that were enumirated in our constition. We have the right to force every congressman and senator to resign, and hold elections. WE!!!!!! are the people. It is our country. They only serve at our pleasure and not the other way around.

If you have a child born today its debt service load for the federal government is 120,000$ on the day its born man.
If you are pleased with the government you are recieving today, and feel like it is fair, then I expect we may end up on different sides.

I all I see is a lack of change.

Just a few comments I have seen today.

While you are so concerned about the 'taxpayers', why don't you run through a scenario where no funds are transfered to banks and the global economy falls apart, collapsing tax revenue bases, resulting in the layoff of millions of public and private workers.

"Gentlemen, I have had men watching you for a long time and I am convinced that you have used the funds of the bank to speculate in the breadstuffs of the country. When you won, you divided the profits amongst you, and when you lost, you charged it to the bank. You tell me that if I take the deposits from the bank and annul its charter, I shall ruin ten thousand families. That may be true, gentlemen, but that is your sin! Should I let you go on, you will ruin fifty thousand families, and that would be my sin! You are a den of vipers and thieves."

Andrew Jackson, 1836 - forced the closing of the Second Bank of the U.S. by revoking its charter
------
This stealing this fraudulent preference to the banks MUST CONTINUE, for only one reason - we the people are not outraged enough yet to do something about it.

Keep it up Wall Street - please, please keep it up - you have no idea NO IDEA of the rage that is building just for you.
----------
I'm not even sure what to say.. I voted for this jerk Obama, and now I see he is nothing but a shill for all these bankers.. rarely have I felt this disgusted over all this bailout stuff. But this thievery is disgusting beyond words..

I know people,just like everyone here and elsewhere, who are just average hardworking americans.. trying to earn a living.. didn't get mixed up with any of this crap.. and now THEY HAVE TO PAY THE BILLS FOR MISTAKES THAT WERE NOT THEIRS????

I have lost complete faith in the fairness of this system...I beleive in free markets, but for a market to be "free", it has to be fair, and I guess I was naive enough to believe it was fair..

I have lost all faith in Obama.. he is nothing but an extension of the Bush administration. At least Bush didn't lie or pretend to be for the people.. and didn't hide behind a telepromter. Obama is worse, much much worse than Bush.

I trust neither political party..now I look back and see that at least Sarah Palin broke up the oil monopoly in Alaska.. at least she tried and sucessed in breaking up the corruption in Alaska.

I just have no words for this theft.

Wanna see alot more?????

Read a bit of the real news that is not sanitised by the news giants whoes job is to get you buy the product they advertise............


http://zerohedge.blogspot.com/2009/03/exclusive-aig-was-responsible-for-banks.html

Read a bit about what is really happening.

The news that HOUSING SALES ARE UP!!!!! Trumpeted on the news. Left off is that is huge foreclosed homes being sold for fractions of their value 2 years ago. WE have been raped by our government.

 

[wrightme43]

Oh and please before I leave. I have a great deal of respect for you. I think you are a good person, and I am very glad you are a part of this forum. If I come across as harsh or mean it is only at ideas I believe to be wrong, not you personally. I have met very few people I did not like on a personal basis wether I agree with them or not. Please understand this. I have voted republican in the past, but I want to stangle every single on of the SOBs now. Dems and Repubs are the same. Evil.

 

[steveindenmark]

I think it is a good idea.

There are so many of these CEOs running companies down and taking massive pensions and pay offs when all the workers are getting laid off.

If the government does not control it, who does??

Steve

 

[LERecords]

Oh and please before I leave. I have a great deal of respect for you. I think you are a good person, and I am very glad you are a part of this forum. If I come across as harsh or mean it is only at ideas I believe to be wrong, not you personally. I have met very few people I did not like on a personal basis wether I agree with them or not. Please understand this. I have voted republican in the past, but I want to stangle every single on of the SOBs now. Dems and Repubs are the same. Evil.

see and this is what i really mean.. I have a great deal of respect for you and your opinion... i just don't share your view and thats whats great about our country.. I would never want to live in a country that didnt give our basic right to question everything.. but yes.. no hard feelings here, just different opinions... cheers to you my friend :thumbup:

 

[Hellgate]

I think it is a good idea.

There are so many of these CEOs running companies down and taking massive pensions and pay offs when all the workers are getting laid off.

If the government does not control it, who does??

Steve

The Board of Directors is who the CEO reports to, the board reports to the shareholders. The government has not part in this unless a law is broken.

99.9999% of CEO do not run companies down, their goal is to improve the Company and make money for the shareholders. Business changes as the industry changes and as business cycles come and go. The Board of Directors okay the compensation plan for the CEO, the CEO with the COO, CFO and others on the CEO's staff analyze business conditions and balance the workforce accordingly. If a lay off is required, so be it.

Yes I was laid off in October and have been unemployed since then and I harbor no ill will towards my former employer.

 

[Cuba]

As I said before the elections, during, and after, this is what happens when you dispose of our system of checks and balances. This is what happens when one party, either party, has their brief window of unregulated legislation. Outrageous spending, power grabs, constitutional infringement, etc. If there had been a large republican majority in the house and senate I would have voted Obama. Those that voted for a socialist with no experience, that has never bucked his party, that simply has done as he was told or voted present, while the democrats control both the house and senate, are fools. America is founded on the system of checks and balances. Now ultra liberals are applauding the idea of a one party system where they would have control of our businesses, our industry, our taxes, and our rights. That my friends, is called National Socialism and it has been tried before. None of this is new, not the recession, not the power grab, not the nationalization, not the infringement of rights, none of it is new. Why can't people see that this has all happened before and the results were disasterous each time? Do we strive to be another Venezuela? REALLY?