Blown Head Gasket? Sealer?

[JoeSTL]

A little while ago, I posted this about leaking coolant from the water pump.

http://www.600riders.com/forum/fz6-general-discussion/51977-water-pump-hose-leak.html

After lots of good advice I decided to start off by flushing the system and adding more coolant. The stuff that came out of there was nasty. I don't think it's ever been changed. I rode all weekend with no problems and I'm currently not experiencing a leak from the same area. When I was sitting next to the bike and letting it cycle through, I noticed a liquid spitting out of my exhaust. Mid last year, I noticed these holes in the rear fender and a mark on my tire, but never knew what the problem was. Here's a pic of the fender:

I changed the oil and coolant was not in it, but it is definitely leaking into the exhaust. So I assume a blown head gasket right? If so, that sucks big time. I continued looking online and found some posts about a block sealer called K-Seal. Has anyone used this stuff? I guess you add some to your coolant and fibers seal up the cracks in the gasket. I think I may give it a try, I just want to see if anyone else has used it here. I've read tons of great reviews, though mostly from the UK.

 

[mattwitt]

I noticed this also.. I think it was condensation.. I let my bike idle a bit and I get this same thing.. I know I read somewhere on here that there are weep holes to let the moisture out so it doesn't settle somewhere lower..

 

[FinalImpact]

AM I missing something, are you thinking the moisture from the exhaust melted the hugger???

Although the coolant was nasty and some amount of moisture came out the exhaust, I really don't not have significant evidence to support the conclusion drawn.

If you plug the exhaust for storage outside, it will trap and hold moisture. It will spray **water** out its backside with furry when rev'd! IMO there is no amount of water you could excrete from the bikes exhaust to melt the hugger. I'm not sure what happened there but I think that is very unlikely. On 105°F my exhaust meted a hole though the under-seat storage pan, but its within a 0.5" of the plastic and I was goin like I stole the thing. It was HOT and did some melty. Looks nothing like that tho (link: http://www.600riders.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=52149&stc=1&d=1393298729).


If any of the following are true:

• Compression test showed cylinder X of X was down by 75 psi
• Found anti-freeze in the oil (milkshake oil)
• The coolant tank is shooting out volumes of steam
• Found oil in the coolant
• The exhaust throws a steam cloud that never stops no matter how warm the engine is....

These are the **typical** signs of a blown head gasket. Can you say any of these are also true to your situation???

What does the exhaust look like when its fully warmed up and riding for 20 min??

 

[OZXJR]

AM I missing something, are you thinking the moisture from the exhaust melted the hugger???

I was thinking the same , perhaps the hole in the tyre came first ?

 

[FinalImpact]

I was thinking the same , perhaps the hole in the tyre came first ?

It looks like the person whom committed homicide with the squirrel (different thread) also may have played a role in the damage to that rear hugger! :don'tknow: :rof::rof: j/k....


Seriously - from this shot, it doesn't look melted.....

 

[JoeSTL]

AM I missing something, are you thinking the moisture from the exhaust melted the hugger???

Although the coolant was nasty and some amount of moisture came out the exhaust, I really don't not have significant evidence to support the conclusion drawn.

If you plug the exhaust for storage outside, it will trap and hold moisture. It will spray **water** out its backside with furry when rev'd! IMO there is no amount of water you could excrete from the bikes exhaust to melt the hugger. I'm not sure what happened there but I think that is very unlikely. On 105°F my exhaust meted a hole though the under-seat storage pan, but its within a 0.5" of the plastic and I was goin like I stole the thing. It was HOT and did some melty. Looks nothing like that tho (link: http://www.600riders.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=52149&stc=1&d=1393298729).


If any of the following are true:

• Compression test showed cylinder X of X was down by 75 psi
• Found anti-freeze in the oil (milkshake oil)
• The coolant tank is shooting out volumes of steam
• Found oil in the coolant
• The exhaust throws a steam cloud that never stops no matter how warm the engine is....

These are the **typical** signs of a blown head gasket. Can you say any of these are also true to your situation???

What does the exhaust look like when its fully warmed up and riding for 20 min??

I have a pin sized hole in the exhaust mid pipe and it is spewing liquid directly over the area in the pic, so I don't know what else could be causing it to melt/corrode.

If it's not the head gasket, then what else can the problem be? I was told by FJR, that the water pump could be failing, which is why I had my original leak. Could this be a reason why I'm loosing my coolant through the exhaust?

 

[FinalImpact]

There were several questions in that post, can you offer insight on any of them?

In addition: When does it start spraying water, how long does it do it, and how much water do you have to add? Have you been riding it this way???

A picture of it spraying or a video??
We are not there, and need more information. Share all you can...

 

[yamihoe]

If you are a larger person and the exhaust comes in contact with the hugger and presses it agianst the tire then thats how I can see the damage to the hugger, assuming the rear preload is set very low.
but that has absolutely nothing to do with the headgasket. thats like saying my tire is flat, it must be a fuse.

 

[JoeSTL]

If you are a larger person and the exhaust comes in contact with the hugger and presses it agianst the tire then thats how I can see the damage to the hugger, assuming the rear preload is set very low.
but that has absolutely nothing to do with the headgasket. thats like saying my tire is flat, it must be a fuse.

You know, I never thought of this. I am a big guy, but I haven't really bottomed out much, if ever. Plus the preload is set high. HOWEVER, the 2 or 3 times my gf rode with me a few months back, I know I was riding pretty low... Makes sense why it the fender is melted now...LOL.

The only reason why I though it had to do with the head gasket, is because of the fluid coming out of the exhaust. And I've read that coolant in the exhaust is due to a blown head gasket. I'm a work and it's like 11pm, so no pics or videos of the spewing liquid right now.

• Compression test showed cylinder X of X was down by 75 psi
• Found anti-freeze in the oil (milkshake oil)
• The coolant tank is shooting out volumes of steam
• Found oil in the coolant
• The exhaust throws a steam cloud that never stops no matter how warm the engine is....

These are the **typical** signs of a blown head gasket. Can you say any of these are also true to your situation???

What does the exhaust look like when its fully warmed up and riding for 20 min??

Basically NO to all your questions and I don't have equipment for a compression test. I also never noticed white steam/smoke coming out of the exhaust once it's warmed up.

So not a head gasket, I guess?? I think that's awesome....but I'm still worried about the fluid coming out of the exhaust. I'll run it tomorrow and see if I can get a video or pic of it.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

If you pull the hugger off (not hard) you should be able to see the inside of it.

Whether the tire rubbed up against the inside of it (which it likely would have if it meet the muffler) due to being over loaded. It'll be VERY obvious. From what I can see of your fender, the wear to the fender appears to follow your rear tire tread pattern ("arrow" looking damage pointing forward, same direction as your tread pattern)


Re the water pump, if it was bad it would pretty much just leak at the lower side of the cover. It wouldn't pump coolant into the exhaust, combustion chamber, etc.


Note, for some reason (and I remember posting on that thread), my post is gone..?? (I didn't delete it)

 

[FZ09Bandit]

Fluid coming out of the exhaust? You need to figure out what it is even if you have to taste it. I know it's gross but it will tell you the difference between antifreeze and water. Water coming out of the exhaust is really no big deal. I've never had a bike do it noticeably but most of my vehicles do.

 

[FZ09Bandit]

If you pull the hugger off (not hard) you should be able to see the inside of it.

Whether the tire rubbed up against the inside of it (which it likely would have if it meet the muffler) due to being over loaded. It'll be VERY obvious. From what I can see of your fender, the wear to the fender appears to follow your rear tire tread pattern ("arrow" looking damage pointing forward, same direction as your tread pattern)


Re the water pump, if it was bad it would pretty much just leak at the lower side of the cover. It wouldn't pump coolant into the exhaust, combustion chamber, etc.


Note, for some reason (and I remember posting on that thread), my post is gone..?? (I didn't delete it)

How dare you post up good info! Maybe if everyone thought you where joking it would have stayed?

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

I just came back in from a ride to the PO and noticed I have considerably more room between the rear tire your swing arm fender (as if yours got squashed down), 1.25"... Stock size PRIII.

Maybe yours is just the camera angle but I'd be looking close at that.

And +1 on just a slight taste on what's dripping, doesn't take much to know if its water or coolant..

 

[FinalImpact]

How dare you post up good info! Maybe if everyone thought you where joking it would have stayed?

I'm guessing it has something to do with age and the "Preview Post" vs actual "Submit Reply" buttons... One is awesome, the other is not; well with reference to an actual post that others see! Blah Ask how I know!

As far as you two tasting everything - I'll opt for just rubbing it between my fingers, if that's inconclusive, smell it, if those fail, WAG, as I'm not tasting it!

 

[FZ09Bandit]

I'm guessing it has something to do with age and the "Preview Post" vs actual "Submit Reply" buttons... One is awesome, the other is not; well with reference to an actual post that others see! Blah Ask how I know!

As far as you two tasting *everything* - I'll opt for just rubbing it between my fingers, if that's inconclusive, smell it, if those fail, WAG, as I'm not tasting it!

Another well thought out assumption, not all coolant is blue and one can definitely see the difference between between mixed oil and green oil. Just a suggestion; however, feel free to keep the click of the wild ass guess. No one says drink it. Ever lay up underneath something on the hot ass pavement in the summer trying to figure out a coolant leak or just moisture? Not all leaks are created equal. My methods are unorthodox, but seem to get me by.

Or perhaps I should have said get a glass of whatever it is and chug down Blah

OP. Putting headgasket stop leak in anything is a bad idea. There is a reason while those companies make bank. Because people have to keep putting it in there creating a false sense of security getting you far from home.

 

[FinalImpact]

^^ Once you're been around a bunch of rigs of gas diesel, home, commercial, and industrial, farm, pleasure, etc - you get a sense for what fluids are what and how they feel between your fingers. And how most smell. So to be fair, its an experience thing. Although they actually teach this in high school these days (my son).

Glycol is glycol and it has its own texture. Water will evaporate from a few quick rubs, and anti-freeze won't.

/OT
What you wrote reminded me of mid 1990's working at AAMCO. Laying on my back in a parking lot pulling the valve body from a 45Ft motor home. The beast was Chev chassis with a 454 c.i. Chev BB, 4" exhausts, TH400 trans that didn't upshift. It was 100F outside and dropping the pan, fluid, and valve body - pretty sure all of it was about 280°F! It was the hottest anything I ever worked on! We installed it, it made about 25 mile loop in the customers hands, came back not shifting. They were standing there waiting for a fix as it was their vacation time on the chopping block. The good ol days at AAMCO. I don't miss that so much.

/thread return

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

I'm guessing it has something to do with age and the "Preview Post" vs actual "Submit Reply" buttons... One is awesome, the other is not; well with reference to an actual post that others see! Blah Ask how I know!

Naw, I remember it did post, as I wrote it was likely the water pump failing/ beginning to leak, not the hoses (which the WP turned out to be fine apparently)..

BTW, I wouldn't think twice about confirming the contents, (water vs coolant) with such a small dab on your finger tip. You don't need a spoonful... For someone without a lot of experiance, this would help you quickly narrow things down pretty accuratly. :thumbup:

Back to the fender damage, looking at the space between my fender and tire vs yours, your damage appears to be from bottoming out and nothing to do with that "leakage"..

 

[JoeSTL]

Naw, I remember it did post, as I wrote it was likely the water pump failing/ beginning to leak, not the hoses (which the WP turned out to be fine apparently)..

BTW, I wouldn't think twice about confirming the contents, (water vs coolant) with such a small dab on your finger tip. You don't need a spoonful... For someone without a lot of experiance, this would help you quickly narrow things down pretty accuratly. :thumbup:

Back to the fender damage, looking at the space between my fender and tire vs yours, your damage appears to be from bottoming out and nothing to do with that "leakage"..

You're thinking of my previous thread about the water pump leak. You sent me a PM saying it was most likely the water pump failing.

I didn't taste it... though I did rub between fingers and smell it and it has absolutely no smell and basically feels like water. I ran the bike for about 15 minutes today and it was spurting out the entire time. My exhaust was also white the entire 15 minutes.

Here's a video of the spewing:

 

[FinalImpact]

I really don't think this is enough to say your head gasket is blown. If it simply ran for 15 minutes, its not the same as being ridden 15 min.

The better question is WHAT does the exhaust out the back look like? If it looks like this; you have issues. [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7l9R5W869QE]Eclipse GST engine Failure - YouTube[/ame]

Do you plug the exhaust when its parked? If YES, IT WILL TRAP ALLOT OF MOISTURE!

Show a video from much father away on HOT engine that's been ridden for 10 min.

 

[JoeSTL]

I really don't think this is enough to say your head gasket is blown. If it simply ran for 15 minutes, its not the same as being ridden 15 min.

The better question is WHAT does the exhaust out the back look like? If it looks like this; you have issues.

Do you plug the exhaust when its parked? If YES, IT WILL TRAP ALLOT OF MOISTURE!

Show a video from much father away on HOT engine that's been ridden for 10 min.

I've never plugged the exhaust.

It's in the 20's tomorrow, but I'll bundle up and ride for a bit, then take another video.

I'm no mechanic, but if the coolant is disappearing and not going into the oil, then where else is it going?