GkS
Junior Member
So, just to not make any mistakes with it, what you mean is that I should loosen screws, numbered: 3, 1 and the wheel axel? But not to touch number 4...Is that correct?
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My fazer has lost stability on curves
- Thread starter GkS
- Start date
So, just to not make any mistakes with it, what you mean is that I should loosen screws, numbered: 3, 1 and the wheel axel? But not to touch number 4...Is that correct?
Marthy
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I haven't had to do this on my FZ but have done it to other bikes in the past, it does help... Very good point
Out of topic... I notice in your signature your reusable oil filter... Got me curious. I'm right here in WPB off of PGA by the downtown at the Gardens. We should go for a ride one day... Actually I'm riding to Daytona Saturday am for a little FZ6R meet up (Wing House by 11:30am) If you were planning to go let me know. Cheers
RJ2112
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So, just to not make any mistakes with it, what you mean is that I should loosen screws, numbered: 3, 1 and the wheel axel? But not to touch number 4...Is that correct?
3, 1, wheel axle, and the ones holding the fender on. (not numbered in your photo.) LEAVE #4 TIGHT.
callmegandhi
IM4TH
Check your air pressure. Ifeels mushy when the tires are a little low.
GkS
Junior Member
Ok guys, I want to give you an update on this case, after a long time the search for the cause of my instability has ended.
I took the bike to a specialized center and after various measurements, it came out that front fork system is not as it should be, it's no more straight and that's why I had this feeling like pulling me on one side.
Also, rear suspension, we knew that, is wasted.
I am correcting all this mess now, by removing and straightening the fork in a special machine with millimeter accuracy and by installing, on the rear, a brand new Ohlins suspension (YA723), which by the way I found in a local Yamaha store here in Athens, with a great discount.
Costs, all together:
Straightening forks: 170euro
Suspension: 635euro
Work: 30euro
Total: 835euro (all prices with vat:23%)
I didn't want to spend all this money, I'll be suffering for this month, but I want my bike to be ready for next year, cause I have a lot in my mind for travelling....
Thank you all,
I will come back with impressions after I get the bike on my hands again and making some km.
I took the bike to a specialized center and after various measurements, it came out that front fork system is not as it should be, it's no more straight and that's why I had this feeling like pulling me on one side.
Also, rear suspension, we knew that, is wasted.
I am correcting all this mess now, by removing and straightening the fork in a special machine with millimeter accuracy and by installing, on the rear, a brand new Ohlins suspension (YA723), which by the way I found in a local Yamaha store here in Athens, with a great discount.
Costs, all together:
Straightening forks: 170euro
Suspension: 635euro
Work: 30euro
Total: 835euro (all prices with vat:23%)
I didn't want to spend all this money, I'll be suffering for this month, but I want my bike to be ready for next year, cause I have a lot in my mind for travelling....
Thank you all,
I will come back with impressions after I get the bike on my hands again and making some km.
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Good to hear George!:rockon:
But wasn't your main complaint from riding 2up?
Hopefully all that helps. . .
Hopefully all that helps. . .
With the rear spring weakening over time (could be), adding a load to the rear (2up + extras), and installation of the new fork springs, I can only imagine that the nose was way high, the tail sunk, and the steering angle you are used to was now very undesirable which would in fact make it scary to drive especially if the tire pressure was low for the load imposed.
Are you sure you didn't exceed the 400lb load carrying specification for the bike?
And what shape are your tires in? If all squared off from highway miles, this could make it feel strange in the corners too.
GkS
Junior Member
Look, let's not say the same things again and again.
- No way I exceeded the max load of this bike.
- Tires are brand new ST's (Z8), only ~6.000km on them, I have checked them twice for faults (tires are perfect), pressure I check personally before every ride.
Tomorrow I will get the bike back, I will need to make a few kms before I can really say if things are better (should be).
Thanks for the help and interest everybody.
GkS
Junior Member
Status Update
Hello again everybody!
As I promissed, I came back to this post to give a status update of this situation, to those who are interested.
So, after I got back the bike, with the fork fixed and a brand new ohlins YA723 for rear suspension, I tested it thoroughly. I did 2 trips of about 1500km in total in these holidays and my verdict is....that the bike rocks again!!! :rockon:
Bike's behavior has been restored to previous experience, when it was brand new and much much better! Finally, the riding has become again a pleasure and the feeling, both the suspensions give now (front & rear, both ohlins), is really nice and smooth...you feel that both tires have traction and not only it's stable and accurate on curves, but it actually feels like it tells you "lean more"...hehehe, I am impressed!
There's only one problem with the steering bar, since it seems from the fall it had taken it is a little lower in height on the right hand....it makes my shoulder feel tired after a good amount of km's, but I will change completely the bar on the next service, with a new one.
So, I am happy again, bike found it's lost character, I love riding it and will surelly make many,many more km's this year than the previous one.
If somebody is thinking about what mod should pull to this bike, I clearly suggest suspensions.....you won't regret it!
Thank you all that followed this story....Happy riding everyone!.... :Sport:
Hello again everybody!
As I promissed, I came back to this post to give a status update of this situation, to those who are interested.
So, after I got back the bike, with the fork fixed and a brand new ohlins YA723 for rear suspension, I tested it thoroughly. I did 2 trips of about 1500km in total in these holidays and my verdict is....that the bike rocks again!!! :rockon:
Bike's behavior has been restored to previous experience, when it was brand new and much much better! Finally, the riding has become again a pleasure and the feeling, both the suspensions give now (front & rear, both ohlins), is really nice and smooth...you feel that both tires have traction and not only it's stable and accurate on curves, but it actually feels like it tells you "lean more"...hehehe, I am impressed!
There's only one problem with the steering bar, since it seems from the fall it had taken it is a little lower in height on the right hand....it makes my shoulder feel tired after a good amount of km's, but I will change completely the bar on the next service, with a new one.
So, I am happy again, bike found it's lost character, I love riding it and will surelly make many,many more km's this year than the previous one.
If somebody is thinking about what mod should pull to this bike, I clearly suggest suspensions.....you won't regret it!
Thank you all that followed this story....Happy riding everyone!.... :Sport:
DeusEx
Junior Member
Re: Status Update
Nice to hear your bike is fun again!
I also have noticed a similar feeling on my bike. I installed WP front springs with a "heavier" oil as suggested by the mechanic, which improved a lot the front end feeling.
But when I try to lean my bike in a corner, it feels kind of wobbling rear. It gives me no confidence to lean further down.
My current back suspension is stock, and set to -3-
A setting of say, -5-, could possibly improve this loose feeling?
PS: I also live in Athens, where is the specialist who did the measurements and corrections?
Nice to hear your bike is fun again!
I also have noticed a similar feeling on my bike. I installed WP front springs with a "heavier" oil as suggested by the mechanic, which improved a lot the front end feeling.
But when I try to lean my bike in a corner, it feels kind of wobbling rear. It gives me no confidence to lean further down.
My current back suspension is stock, and set to -3-
A setting of say, -5-, could possibly improve this loose feeling?
PS: I also live in Athens, where is the specialist who did the measurements and corrections?
GkS
Junior Member
Re: Status Update
Look, you have to understand that the feeling I described was caused due to two main factors; The damaged front system and the wasted rear suspension.
So now, to help you I can describe you my experience and only that.
With the change of the front suspension (Ohlins), I was also suggested to use a thicker fork oil and after searching for many hours in forums like this one and also the Greek one (yes international forum is great, but roads in Greece are a different story), I did find the right degree of oil, I think number 10, since ohlins was suggesting number 5 when the original from yamaha was even less. I had noticed the difference immediately, like you described, a great improvement in the front. The thing though is that front and back weren't working well together, so I had to tighten up a bit that shock and the thing was going well, until that damn day I fell in a curve with my girlfriend, that by the way, in my mind, I have connected this to the old shock's failure, since it was really unexplainable in other ways.
So, there are various topics online about finding the right suspension settings for your bike, you can give it a try.Yamaha Shock's default setting from factory is position 3, depending on your weight you can configure, for example I was ok with 4 alone (90kg) and 5 with passenger (55kg more). When the damn thing went off, I had to go to 6 and later to the max (7) or I would find my self hanging from a tree after some fast curve, cause I was experiencing that weird wobbling you say on the rear, causing also the front to lose traction and to behave strangely. So, this probably means for you, that by increasing the setting to one position could give better results.
As for specialists, there are some in Athens, you could try with the widely known K-shock, but there are also mechanics who really know their thing, like there is one very good indeed at Larisis st. above Panormou, it's a yamaha workshop, the guy does a great job, but is a bit expensive...
I went to my known mechanic who also works for yamaha, it's the yamaha store/workshop at Ag.Paraskeui (Xalandriou 6). Actually, as we speak he's taking care of my baby, changing the damaged steering bar...He's a good mechanic and has very reasonable prices.
I hope I've helped you, if you want more details, send me pm.
Look, you have to understand that the feeling I described was caused due to two main factors; The damaged front system and the wasted rear suspension.
So now, to help you I can describe you my experience and only that.
With the change of the front suspension (Ohlins), I was also suggested to use a thicker fork oil and after searching for many hours in forums like this one and also the Greek one (yes international forum is great, but roads in Greece are a different story), I did find the right degree of oil, I think number 10, since ohlins was suggesting number 5 when the original from yamaha was even less. I had noticed the difference immediately, like you described, a great improvement in the front. The thing though is that front and back weren't working well together, so I had to tighten up a bit that shock and the thing was going well, until that damn day I fell in a curve with my girlfriend, that by the way, in my mind, I have connected this to the old shock's failure, since it was really unexplainable in other ways.
So, there are various topics online about finding the right suspension settings for your bike, you can give it a try.Yamaha Shock's default setting from factory is position 3, depending on your weight you can configure, for example I was ok with 4 alone (90kg) and 5 with passenger (55kg more). When the damn thing went off, I had to go to 6 and later to the max (7) or I would find my self hanging from a tree after some fast curve, cause I was experiencing that weird wobbling you say on the rear, causing also the front to lose traction and to behave strangely. So, this probably means for you, that by increasing the setting to one position could give better results.
As for specialists, there are some in Athens, you could try with the widely known K-shock, but there are also mechanics who really know their thing, like there is one very good indeed at Larisis st. above Panormou, it's a yamaha workshop, the guy does a great job, but is a bit expensive...
I went to my known mechanic who also works for yamaha, it's the yamaha store/workshop at Ag.Paraskeui (Xalandriou 6). Actually, as we speak he's taking care of my baby, changing the damaged steering bar...He's a good mechanic and has very reasonable prices.
I hope I've helped you, if you want more details, send me pm.
DeusEx
Junior Member
Re: Status Update
Thanks for the prompt answer GkS!
Actualy, reading through your thread, caused me yesterday to experiment a bit with my rear shock. I set the rear preload to -5- (from stock -3-) and it got way better!
Not as much as it could with an expensive aftermarket rear shock, but there was noticable improvement.
It seems that the stiffness of the front (WP+heavy oil) requires a stiffnes of the rear to work properly.
Could you explain a bit further the circumstances of the accidents, both the 1st and the 2nd? Symptomps, feelings etc.
Was the rear shock wearing gradually so you had to set the preload to harder until you maxed it out?
I try to understand out the symptoms in detail, in order to figure out the similarities.
Last summer I went with a friend of mine with a same bike (fz6 naked), with the only difference that when he put the front springs, he also replaced the rear spring with a stiffer one. As a result, I really was struggling to follow him on the mountain twisties (ag. gianni roso), with my stock rear. He took the corners much faster and confident than me, while I was having a difficult time to keep my bike from low siding... And even today he's mocking me of not beeing able to corner right
PS: I did my conversion at K-shock
Thanks for the prompt answer GkS!
Actualy, reading through your thread, caused me yesterday to experiment a bit with my rear shock. I set the rear preload to -5- (from stock -3-) and it got way better!
Not as much as it could with an expensive aftermarket rear shock, but there was noticable improvement.
It seems that the stiffness of the front (WP+heavy oil) requires a stiffnes of the rear to work properly.
Could you explain a bit further the circumstances of the accidents, both the 1st and the 2nd? Symptomps, feelings etc.
Was the rear shock wearing gradually so you had to set the preload to harder until you maxed it out?
I try to understand out the symptoms in detail, in order to figure out the similarities.
Last summer I went with a friend of mine with a same bike (fz6 naked), with the only difference that when he put the front springs, he also replaced the rear spring with a stiffer one. As a result, I really was struggling to follow him on the mountain twisties (ag. gianni roso), with my stock rear. He took the corners much faster and confident than me, while I was having a difficult time to keep my bike from low siding... And even today he's mocking me of not beeing able to corner right
PS: I did my conversion at K-shock
GkS
Junior Member
Re: Status Update
Well, let's just say that on 1st one it was my stupidity that got in the way and caused it, cause I didn't buy a sun visor for my helmet (I thought it costed too much), nor I was wearing sunglasses, with the result of being totaly blinded by the sun on a curve from Amfissa to Desfina, I pressed the breaks fearing of hitting a car or something coming from the other side, the bike came up immediately from leaning, there was a wall there at the roadside (preventing from falling down to the cliff), that I didn't see at all....I fell down, the bike went on the wall and after a small jump it crashed on my left leg.....twisting my ankle and breaking all legaments (I went to the hospital and had an operation). Luckily, I was fully equiped and didn't even brake a bone...
As for the 2nd one, we were in 2, going for a small trip to Kalavrita, I had the rear shock allready to 6 cause it was showing some problems, but not such to worry about, I thought....So, I was going slow, around 30, and there was a small right, descending curve where, now I believe, because of the suspension that didn't compensate the force of the turn and instead it compressed all the way, the rear tire lost traction and we fell....but it wasn't hard falling, it was really smooth, I got only a strapped pair of jeans. My gf though suffered a small cut on the leg that troubled us for days cause it got infected (I had medicine and dissinfected it right away, but....not enough probably) and that's all.
After the 2nd one, it was impossible to ride again, on every curve the bike was behaving strangely and I was feeling like the front was being lifted, which is normal after all because of the rear being compressed all the way down! The mechanic told me immediately, when he tested, that the rear shock was wasted....and he was right. Also, it seems that from the 1st hit, the fork needed some fixing also, but that hadn't anything to do with the 2nd fall....it was only giving me some instability on straights.
Feelings, well I had some psycological matters to deal from the 1st fall and I did....but nothing from the 2nd, seems the saying "What doesn't kill you makes you stronger" has some rality in it My gf was afraid after that, but not for long, seems she kept looking down at the asphalt instead of looking in the front, everytime we leaned...after a week she was ok with that too. Of course, this was the first time for her in a fall, so when I was taking care of her leg, she almost fainted a bit, she was feeling nausea (she was under shock) and that's why you must have some water with you, some chocolate etc. to deal with that or with hypoglycemia. We were lucky...
Normally I am a very carefull rider, I ride for more than 15 years now and I don't do crazy stuff. Also, like I said before, Greece's roads are really meant to deal with fear and respect....you never know what you will come up to one the next turn...it seems that being carefull is never enough.
Well, let's just say that on 1st one it was my stupidity that got in the way and caused it, cause I didn't buy a sun visor for my helmet (I thought it costed too much), nor I was wearing sunglasses, with the result of being totaly blinded by the sun on a curve from Amfissa to Desfina, I pressed the breaks fearing of hitting a car or something coming from the other side, the bike came up immediately from leaning, there was a wall there at the roadside (preventing from falling down to the cliff), that I didn't see at all....I fell down, the bike went on the wall and after a small jump it crashed on my left leg.....twisting my ankle and breaking all legaments (I went to the hospital and had an operation). Luckily, I was fully equiped and didn't even brake a bone...
As for the 2nd one, we were in 2, going for a small trip to Kalavrita, I had the rear shock allready to 6 cause it was showing some problems, but not such to worry about, I thought....So, I was going slow, around 30, and there was a small right, descending curve where, now I believe, because of the suspension that didn't compensate the force of the turn and instead it compressed all the way, the rear tire lost traction and we fell....but it wasn't hard falling, it was really smooth, I got only a strapped pair of jeans. My gf though suffered a small cut on the leg that troubled us for days cause it got infected (I had medicine and dissinfected it right away, but....not enough probably) and that's all.
After the 2nd one, it was impossible to ride again, on every curve the bike was behaving strangely and I was feeling like the front was being lifted, which is normal after all because of the rear being compressed all the way down! The mechanic told me immediately, when he tested, that the rear shock was wasted....and he was right. Also, it seems that from the 1st hit, the fork needed some fixing also, but that hadn't anything to do with the 2nd fall....it was only giving me some instability on straights.
Feelings, well I had some psycological matters to deal from the 1st fall and I did....but nothing from the 2nd, seems the saying "What doesn't kill you makes you stronger" has some rality in it
My gf was afraid after that, but not for long, seems she kept looking down at the asphalt instead of looking in the front, everytime we leaned...after a week she was ok with that too. Of course, this was the first time for her in a fall, so when I was taking care of her leg, she almost fainted a bit, she was feeling nausea (she was under shock) and that's why you must have some water with you, some chocolate etc. to deal with that or with hypoglycemia. We were lucky...Normally I am a very carefull rider, I ride for more than 15 years now and I don't do crazy stuff. Also, like I said before, Greece's roads are really meant to deal with fear and respect....you never know what you will come up to one the next turn...it seems that being carefull is never enough.
DeusEx
Junior Member
Re: Status Update
Well said.. I'm glad that both of you are ok!
I'll keep my eye on the rear shock, now that I'm suspicious of it causing all my troubles.
Greek roads are treacherous and unforgiving. Unfortunatelly, I've made that experience myself, twice. I had 2 accidents after 9 years of driving motorcycles, both of them were caused by huge potholes (the 2nd one was invisible due to rain.A day later I inspected it and it was deep enough to put a 1,5L bottle all the way in.)
However, I'm an optimist! I too say "what doesn't kill you makes you stronger" and "Live to ride another day"
Well said.. I'm glad that both of you are ok!
I'll keep my eye on the rear shock, now that I'm suspicious of it causing all my troubles.
Greek roads are treacherous and unforgiving. Unfortunatelly, I've made that experience myself, twice. I had 2 accidents after 9 years of driving motorcycles, both of them were caused by huge potholes (the 2nd one was invisible due to rain.A day later I inspected it and it was deep enough to put a 1,5L bottle all the way in.)
However, I'm an optimist! I too say "what doesn't kill you makes you stronger" and "Live to ride another day"
GkS
Junior Member
Tomorrow I'm thinking of going for a ride, close by, just to stretch a bit. Nothing fast or crazy, just a few calm kms, coffee somewhere nice, etc.
We'll be 2 fazers, me and a friend, also member of this forum.
If you feel like coming, we can also talk more thoroughly about this, send me a pm here and we'll talk.
We'll be 2 fazers, me and a friend, also member of this forum.
If you feel like coming, we can also talk more thoroughly about this, send me a pm here and we'll talk.
DeusEx
Junior Member
Let's go for a ride! You've got pm...
