Chain "cracking" under load/take-off

[FinalImpact]

Very useful info here!!!
I started feeling/hearing this same thing about a week (or two) ago.
Initially I lubed the chain and it seems to be ok now.

After reading different posts here I went to take a closer look at the sprockets on my bike, which I think don't look that bad. I removed the cover of the front sprocket ... So the chain (and sprockets are due for a nice clean up.
I'm around 18,000 miles now so let's see how far this sale chain and sprockets will last.

Nice job Andz!!!!

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2cents:
That chain and sprocket look to be void of lubricants. And If I were a bettin guy I'd bet the nut is loose! Why, because the sprocket is covered in that red dust. It's present when metallic parts wear on each other. In this case I'd bet that if you pulled the sprocket off, the splines would be all shinny and you'd find more of the red powder dust stuff. Put a new nut on it and torque to spec. Up your lubrication interval and quantity too. Feel free to make a mess by using too much!

 

[Andz]

2cents:
That chain and sprocket look to be void of lubricants. And If I were a bettin guy I'd bet the nut is loose! Why, because the sprocket is covered in that red dust. It's present when metallic parts wear on each other. In this case I'd bet that if you pulled the sprocket off, the splines would be all shinny and you'd find more of the red powder dust stuff. Put a new nut on it and torque to spec. Up your lubrication interval and quantity too. Feel free to make a mess by using too much!

I don't know whose front sprocket that is but it's not mine, check my post again That is not the original nut and the lock washer is
missing!

OK I see it is AngelFZ's sprocket...

Interval between lube.... who knows, I lube it when I remember to. I use Castrol Chain Wax. I don't ride in the rain much but I do lube it after every wash.

 

[FinalImpact]

I don't know whose front sprocket that is but it's not mine, check my post again That is not the original nut and the lock washer is
missing!

OK I see it is AngelFZ's sprocket...

Interval between lube.... who knows, I lube it when I remember to. I use Castrol Chain Wax. I don't ride in the rain much but I do lube it after every wash.

Ya, I gathered that it wasn't yours and as you see its been recycled. Thanks for sharing about the chain-lube brand.

 

[AngelFZ]

2cents:
That chain and sprocket look to be void of lubricants. And If I were a bettin guy I'd bet the nut is loose! Why, because the sprocket is covered in that red dust. It's present when metallic parts wear on each other. In this case I'd bet that if you pulled the sprocket off, the splines would be all shinny and you'd find more of the red powder dust stuff. Put a new nut on it and torque to spec. Up your lubrication interval and quantity too. Feel free to make a mess by using too much!

Thanks for your observations and comments, I'll definitely make sure the nut is not loose!!!!!

I lube the chain after riding in the rain and I'm trying to make a point of lubing it every 1,000 miles or so. Obviously I have not been keeping up very well on that task.

It was after reading this thread that i went to uncover the front sprocket!!!!

I'm glad I can learn more and more about my bike and it's basic maintenance.


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[SweaterDude]

my bike doesnt have enough miles yet for any real wear to be happening but here's what i use on my chain: Motul Chain Cleaner and RK Chain Lube (this stuff is the bomb. Dad swears by it and has been using it for 20 years. its really hard to find though) Oh and i use a Grunge Brush with the cleaner.

 

[YZF73]

That is not the original nut and the lock washer is
missing!

I got a little worried seeing this as I remember my setup looks exactly like Angels , upon checking the exploded diagrams for the '04 and '07 models it appears that the '04 has the lock washer setup, and the '07 has a different plain looking washer.

With the recall on the '04 models, I can't see why Yamaha seem to be using what looks to me like a much less reliable way to secure the front sprocket on the newer models?, saying that I don't think I've heard of anyone having their front sprocket nut come loose on an '07 onwards model?


Yamahaboyz

 

[FinalImpact]

Thanks for your observations and comments, I'll definitely make sure the nut is not loose!!!!!

I lube the chain after riding in the rain and I'm trying to make a point of lubing it every 1,000 miles or so. Obviously I have not been keeping up very well on that task.

It was after reading this thread that i went to uncover the front sprocket!!!!

I'm glad I can learn more and more about my bike and it's basic maintenance.


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Its hard to tell from the photo but it looks like yours should be replaced as its already been off once before OR it wasn't staked very well to begin with. With a new nut, torque it to spec and then stake the edge into the open slots on the output shaft. Also I'd opt for some Red loctite to the threads during the install. Please ask questions if you have any doubts about this.

 

[FinalImpact]

I got a little worried seeing this as I remember my setup looks exactly like Angels , upon checking the exploded diagrams for the '04 and '07 models it appears that the '04 has the lock washer setup, and the '07 has a different plain looking washer.

With the recall on the '04 models, I can't see why Yamaha seem to be using what looks to me like a much less reliable way to secure the front sprocket on the newer models?, saying that I don't think I've heard of anyone having their front sprocket nut come loose on an '07 onwards model?


Yamahaboyz

The later model with the staked nut is pretty well used in the industry. Like I said above, clean the threads and apply some red loctite and torque to spec 61ft/lbs / 85Nm and stake it. It should be fine.

Question to those who have the 04 bikes and had them factory update, did they replace the output shaft or grind slots in it so it could be staked and use the later style nut? Just curious. . .

 

[Andz]

Question to those who have the 04 bikes and had them factory update, did they replace the output shaft or grind slots in it so it could be staked and use the later style nut? Just curious. . .

I have an '04 and nothing was done to it, I wasn't informed about any recall, maybe it was certain countries only. Mine is as shown above (obviously )

 

[fb40dash5]

The later model with the staked nut is pretty well used in the industry. Like I said above, clean the threads and apply some red loctite and torque to spec 61ft/lbs / 85Nm and stake it. It should be fine.

Question to those who have the 04 bikes and had them factory update, did they replace the output shaft or grind slots in it so it could be staked and use the later style nut? Just curious. . .

If it doesn't call for red loctite, I'd be careful about using it. Especially on threads that big, you might need some heat to get it loose, as well as an impact. With that much break-free torque, I wouldn't want to be using an impact on the output shaft, unless I had something besides putting the trans in gear or the tire on the ground to hold the sprocket.

If it's staked anyway, you probably don't need any at all, but blue might be a better choice.

 

[FinalImpact]

If it doesn't call for red loctite, I'd be careful about using it. Especially on threads that big, you might need some heat to get it loose, as well as an impact. With that much break-free torque, I wouldn't want to be using an impact on the output shaft, unless I had something besides putting the trans in gear or the tire on the ground to hold the sprocket.

If it's staked anyway, you probably don't need any at all, but blue might be a better choice.

Indeed - A LITTLE goes a long ways! Good point.

As in, don't coat the entire threaded area, just "a" drop will do when clean. I personally would still go for the red and with the chain on, apply the brake to torque it and/or remove it.

 

[Andz]

Well I decided to do it anyway .

How do you get the f'ing front sprocket nut loose???


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[CBRF3RIDER]

Well I decided to do it anyway .

How do you get the f'ing front sprocket nut loose???


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I hope you kept the chain and the rear sprocket on! Put the bike in gear and have someone hold the rear brake. They will seriously have to stand on it. Do you have an impact wrench?


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[Andz]

Er no I had already cut the old chain off! I changed the rear sprocket, fitted the new chain and put a log through the swing arm then by using the age old principle of leverage (a LONG bar on the socket) I got it off.

Compared to the force needed to get it off the 90Nm torque setting in the manual seems low.


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[Andz]

So this morning I decided to hell with this and went and bought a chain tool.

This is the one I bought:

This is the chain I installed:

DID give you the following parts for the link. On the grease packet it says "do not eat". I don't know why, it is yum!

This is the link with the O rings on, greased and ready to use:

Link in the chain with the other rings on and greased:

Plate ready for pressing:

Tool in place for pressing. I was being very careful not to overtighten it, checking the distance between plates of the links next to it.

Plate pressed ready for flaring the rivets:

Tool set up for rivet flaring:

Job done!

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

So this morning I decided to hell with this and went and bought a chain tool.

This is the one I bought:

This is the chain I installed:

DID give you the following parts for the link. On the grease packet it says "do not eat". I don't know why, it is yum!

This is the link with the O rings on, greased and ready to use:

Link in the chain with the other rings on and greased:

Plate ready for pressing:

Tool in place for pressing. I was being very careful not to overtighten it, checking the distance between plates of the links next to it.

Plate pressed ready for flaring the rivets:

Tool set up for rivet flaring:

Job done!

_________________________________________________________________________________________________


I just replaced my chain with the same x-ring chain as yours (but in black). I opted for the DID tool:

( DID KM501E Sport Cutting and Riveting Tool - Street Bike - Motorcycle Superstore )

Very heavy duty, its impossible to overtighten the master link with this tool and a DID chain (excellent design but not cheap..)

 

[FinalImpact]

I hope you kept the chain and the rear sprocket on! Put the bike in gear and have someone hold the rear brake. They will seriously have to stand on it. Do you have an impact wrench?


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Andz
First off, glad you got this all sorted out - I thought after lube and cleaning it was all good???

Anyway - personally I would not recommend using an impact gun on moving parts like an output shaft. Not that it will break anything, but on occasion the instantaneous shock of the impact gun/wrench can chip gears.

A heavy constant load from a long handle breaker bar (with the chain on) is the preferred method to loosen and tighten the nut.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Andz
First off, glad you got this all sorted out - I thought after lube and cleaning it was all good???

Anyway - personally I would not recommend using an impact gun on moving parts like an output shaft. Not that it will break anything, but on occasion the instantaneous shock of the impact gun/wrench can chip gears.

A heavy constant load from a long handle breaker bar (with the chain on) is the preferred method to loosen and tighten the nut.

I agree, I wouldn't use the impact gun on that nut with it in gear (for loosening it) however in neutral, with the chain/rear sprocket holding the front sprocket, it shouldn't be a problem...

 

[FinalImpact]

I agree, I wouldn't use the impact gun on that nut with it in gear (for loosening it) however in neutral, with the chain/rear sprocket holding the front sprocket, it shouldn't be a problem...

I guess the ideal thing would be a tool that locked the body of the impact to the gear so no shock is delivered to the transmision. That is the most effective way to deliver torque to WHERE it is needed.

Keep in mind the chain would be bouncing all over and the isolation rubbers in the hub would be absorbing allot of the impacts efforts. A breaker bar would likely win the battle sooner. :thumbup:

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

The transmission shaft, as long as its in neutral, won't be stressed, just the nut... Keep tension on the drive chain/sprockets will take the brunt of the force..

Putting a bar (stiff piec of wood) of some sort, thru the rear wheel, below the swing arm (locking up the rear wheel) and getting the chain taught, wether with an air gun or by hand, IMHO, would be the way to go to loosen. Much more solid than holding a brake, etc... Reverse the side of the swing arm stop for tightening...

Its only 65 foot lbs, the chain can very easily handle load (you can apply the rear brake also if needed) but yes, I would not use the gun with it in gear, you'd be applying direct impact to the gear box/gears...