fz6 not running, cant read diagnostic codes

[f6Quad]

Hello everybody, I have a 2006 fz6 that was salvaged from a wreck and turned into a four wheeler, so consequently I do not have a dashboard for it. Anyway, everything was good until the other day when i was riding and the thing shut off. When I tried starting again it would run for a second or so then shut itself off. After two or three times of doing that it quit starting all together and would only crank. Oddly enough when i removed the air filter and tried starting it it went back to running for a second before dying. After reinstalling the air filter it would not run at all. I have not gotten a new air filter yet because it doesn't look too bad to me. I have ruled out fuel pressure and spark plugs, both are good. I realize this is difficult without having any codes but that's why I'm turning here. I haven't had to mess with this engine until now and was hoping someone had more experience than I do. Any and all help is greatly appreciated.

 

[Motogiro]

:welcome: to our great forum!
If you don't have the instrument cluster that goes with the bike you may be missing more than displayed error codes. Start with fuel pressure. How do you know it's good? Are you getting spark? Is the fuel pump priming when you turn the key to on position. How about the run/kill switch? Other things to look for are the sidestand switch wires, Clutch safety switch. Neutral switch.

 

[f6Quad]

I put a pressure gauge on the fuel line. it read almost 40 psi. From what Ive read it was supposed to be about 36. I am getting spark, the fuel pump is priming. I know it is not the kill switch because when I flip it off the engine wont crank at all, and the clutch switch has been bypassed, so I assume the neutral switch isnt the problem either because the bike thinks the clutch is always in. The bike is in neutral so wont it run even with a bad kickstand switch until i put it in gear?

 

[FinalImpact]

Because it does run for a moment the next easy thing to do it give it something it doesn't have. Fuel!

With a syringe, thimble, spoon, whatever, add an equal amount of fuel to each Throttle body venturi. Hit the start button. If it runs longer it may in fact still be a fuel issue. It could have pressure but rust ahead of the injector could induce a false high pressure while not allowing sufficient fuel through. I think its odd all four would plug at once but getting it started on one cylinder would be tough.

If adding fuel does not cause it to start and flame out, then you're likely looking at an ignition issue. Pull the plugs and replace them. Beings its doing more stationary work than a motorcycle (more soak heat from sitting), I'd consider CR10E plugs which are one range cooler than the CR9E.

 

[f6Quad]

okay so its gotta be a gas problem. I was able to get the thing to start twice but only for a minute or two. I reset the computer and after a little trouble she fired up. Very poor running though you could smell it was pretty rich and could see the fumes coming out the exhaust. There was a little lope like it was only running on 3 cylinders but it was only for part of the time. If you revved it it would clear its throat and start running on all four again but eventually it would start loading up and choke itself out. Other things I noticed was the idle was kinda low and the tail light wasnt on when the key was on, although the brake light still worked. I know this may not be relevant but i thought I should add it in case it rings any bells.

So this has got to be a bad sensor right? Any ideas on which one? Fuel injection is really not my thing.

 

[FinalImpact]

Roll with this for a moment:
Any rust in the fuel cell or orther fine debris? Everything you described in the post above sounds like -
A) flooding. i.e. debris in injectors making them leak.
B) Ignition. Like gap is too wide, old plugs, leaking high tension leads so its not able to burn the fuel it has.

Put some new plugs in it. Gap no more than 0.028" max and see what happens.

 

[f6Quad]

New plugs didnt do anything. Whatever is wrong with it seems to only be intermittent. sometimes it'll run for a minute or two, other times for only a second, and other times it wont start at all. When it does decide to run it is very rich and will die quickly even while revved up. its like the key was turned off.

 

[f6Quad]

I'm thinking it might be the coolant temp sensor. when checking the resistance it will bounce between infinite and about 1700 ohms at about 70 degrees.

 

[FinalImpact]

Unplug it and start it. ECU will throw in some default values. Doubt thats it.

What about bad gas? Water in the gas?

 

[f6Quad]

gas should be good. it was pretty low when it died so I threw in some fresh stuff just thinking it ran out. Are you absolutely sure it will run with the temp sensor unplugged? I unplugged it and it wouldnt start at all (which isn't exactly uncommon right now). Does this work for other sensors? It would be nice to just unplug them one by one and see which one is at fault.

 

[FinalImpact]

The ECU will improvise on all sensors (think limp home mode). Well except the CPS. It must know where the crank is or it locks out the start sequence until its position is captured.

The default values will be rich to protect the engine. What I dont know is if it retards the ignition timing. It may for heat and vacuum sensor to protect it self.

Did you ever just pour fuel into the TBs to see how long it runs? It should fire off blubbery rich and be able to run for say 10+ seconds... If the ignition is compromised, it will have a hard time lighting the fuel mixture. Either way you gain information!

 

[f6Quad]

How much gas would you recommend for each cylinder? It seems like more than a couple drops would flood the engine out.

 

[FinalImpact]

A friends FZ wouldn't fire and w/out going to a bunch of work to figure it out, the easiest thing to do is to add fuel. I poured in a good slop in each hole (1/2 cap full to ea TB from fuel container lid), cracked the throttle and hit the starter. It fired off and reved until it ran out of fuel. I then bypassed the Fuel Controller connecting the ECU directly to the Injectors and hit the starter. Fired off again. Back tracked F/C wires and setup finding a fault in the wiring. It took only minutes to deduce Fuel or Ignition as we knew mechanically the engine was sound (ran fine 3 days ago)....

2 - 3cc (2 - 3mL) per TB or roughly 5/8 tsp although less should do something.

hint - if its fouled the plugs, remove them and heat the threaded section with propane torch to dry them. Try not to exceed 300°F

 

[f6Quad]

sorry its been so long.. I added some fuel to each throttle body the engine popped and sputtered for a bit but Im pretty sure it flooded out. I came back a few hours later and tried again but I just got a pop out of it. The other day I just hit the starter and the thing fired up like when I first got it. I was even able to hop on it and ride it for probably around 2 minutes before it died (Fast like the key was turned off) Im not sure whats going on with this thing. Its so intermittent.

 

[FinalImpact]

When it dies and wont fire after being ran, thats a great time to throw some used plugs in the caps, ground the plug body, and hit the starter. If gapped at say 0.045" to 0.050" it should still be able to jump the gap. If there is no spark and the coils have 12v (battery voltage) on one side, you know its the ignition system, wiring, or something in that realm.

You implied it runs ans dies. So place an ice pack on the ecu, chill for 15" and then fire it off.... How long does it run?

What is left of the oem harness, can you attach a cluster (gauge) if you obtained one?

 

[f6Quad]

the plugs seemed to spark okay when I checked them (which was right after it died the first time) I wont be able to work on it until Thursday at the earliest so ill let you know what the ice pack does then. The plugs for the dashboard are still there, but whether or not the wiring is good I do not know. most of the wiring looks factory so I'm hoping I could plug one in.

 

[f6Quad]

I might have access to a dashboard but it is from an 05. Would it diagnose my 06?

 

[FinalImpact]

Should be fine.... Sadly it may not disclose "the issue" but it may help. Do note that you will likely be dismissing a few error codes looking for the ones that matter...

 

[f6Quad]

If you are still following this... i was finally able to try the 05 dashboard on my bike. My wiring harness has been modified too much. The dash wouldnt even light up when i turned the key on, much less have any diagnostic information. So im back to doing it the old fashioned way. The ecu isnt getting too hot. any other ideas?