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Check page 7-29 in your shop manual for checking fuel rail pressure..
04 fz6 been sitting fuel pump issue
When you say you replaced the rotor. Please be specific; did you replace the whole electric pump motor or did you open the electric motor and pull it apart?
You can test all parts in water to be safe and I would start with the pump itself if you had that apart (somehow I think not). If there are cuts, cracks, or nicks in the O-rings or plastic, or if the lock tabs do not secure all parts as intended it could leak internally. You will see this in a bucket of water....
Do you have a syringe you could back flow the electric motor with to test the check valve?
Assemble the pump placing fuel on O-rings and pressure test it in a bucket of water. It should get 36 PSI and only poor water out of the pressure regulator. With the outlet restricted, you should be able to maintain 36 PSI and STREAM some water a good 10 feet with ease. It sure looks like it rusty inside and SAT for some time.
IF SOMEONE was here before you cleaning that rust out, I would bet there is a chance some made it to the injectors and you may end back flowing them to purge the sediment out. We'll get to that once you flow and pressure test your leak free pump!
Hang in there.... and give us PSI reading while holding pump under water. You will want to shake and purge pump in fuel before installing back in the tank.
You can test all parts in water to be safe and I would start with the pump itself if you had that apart (somehow I think not). If there are cuts, cracks, or nicks in the O-rings or plastic, or if the lock tabs do not secure all parts as intended it could leak internally. You will see this in a bucket of water....
Do you have a syringe you could back flow the electric motor with to test the check valve?
Assemble the pump placing fuel on O-rings and pressure test it in a bucket of water. It should get 36 PSI and only poor water out of the pressure regulator. With the outlet restricted, you should be able to maintain 36 PSI and STREAM some water a good 10 feet with ease. It sure looks like it rusty inside and SAT for some time.
IF SOMEONE was here before you cleaning that rust out, I would bet there is a chance some made it to the injectors and you may end back flowing them to purge the sediment out. We'll get to that once you flow and pressure test your leak free pump!
Hang in there.... and give us PSI reading while holding pump under water. You will want to shake and purge pump in fuel before installing back in the tank.
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Bruno1989
New Member
I just replaced the electric motor, didn't know that piece came apart.
I do have a syringe or two laying around.
I'm a little confused about the bucket of water test.
Assemble pump w all parts and I'm guessing place the pump with the fuel outlet out of the water ( so it can shoot out ) and I hook the pump up to the battery somehow and see if it does its magic?
Also I guess with a syringe feed the water into the bottom of electric motor and hook up to battery? To back flow
I do have a syringe or two laying around.
I'm a little confused about the bucket of water test.
Assemble pump w all parts and I'm guessing place the pump with the fuel outlet out of the water ( so it can shoot out ) and I hook the pump up to the battery somehow and see if it does its magic?
Also I guess with a syringe feed the water into the bottom of electric motor and hook up to battery? To back flow
Yes on all accounts ^^^…
But add your pressure gauge to the pumps outlet and here we do two tests. One is the stall test where the oulet is blocked. You measure psi. The second needs valve you can adjust and bleed off some fluid volume while reading pressure. Think in terms of controlled leak. Like running at WOT... JAWAG but id guess something in the neighborhood of 1gal/hr at 36psi... Or divide that down to get it into minues... Using phone to post and it ruins (looses my post if I leave this app). You get the idea tho. It needs to be able to maintain pressure with a small leak on the output side.
But add your pressure gauge to the pumps outlet and here we do two tests. One is the stall test where the oulet is blocked. You measure psi. The second needs valve you can adjust and bleed off some fluid volume while reading pressure. Think in terms of controlled leak. Like running at WOT... JAWAG but id guess something in the neighborhood of 1gal/hr at 36psi... Or divide that down to get it into minues... Using phone to post and it ruins (looses my post if I leave this app). You get the idea tho. It needs to be able to maintain pressure with a small leak on the output side.
Bruno1989
New Member
Tried to upload video but it's giving me a hard time
Not sure about how to hook the pressure gauge up to the fuel pump but I'm getting a consistent 3 foot stream.... Also blocked off fuel outlet and it builds up pressure in a second and shoots out of the pressure reg/relief. I'm guessing its working okay
Haven't tried to back flow pump yet ( partially bc I'm still confused about it ) I flushed it with gas the way it would normally go in after the water, but I wouldn't think that's back flowing it. The fuel gets sucked in the electric motor and doesn't come out of the check valve until I tip it upside down, then it just falls out
Not sure about how to hook the pressure gauge up to the fuel pump but I'm getting a consistent 3 foot stream.... Also blocked off fuel outlet and it builds up pressure in a second and shoots out of the pressure reg/relief. I'm guessing its working okay
Haven't tried to back flow pump yet ( partially bc I'm still confused about it ) I flushed it with gas the way it would normally go in after the water, but I wouldn't think that's back flowing it. The fuel gets sucked in the electric motor and doesn't come out of the check valve until I tip it upside down, then it just falls out
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Well how did you connect and pressure test it the first time?
Hose + clamps + gauge = reading
If you wish to do 2nd test, now you need a "T" more clamps, more hose and either a valves or some kind of restrictor.
As for the pumps check valve. With the pump submerged and a long hose attached to the outlet, if the hose is full and then moved below the pumps inlet i.e. fluid level, when the pump is off, it shouldn't siphon.
Basically we are repeating your leak test when you detach the tank from the bikes fuel rail. Does it leak or does it stop fluid travel?
Look here:
http://www.600riders.com/forum/garage-mechanical-help/55110-starts-dies-help.html
http://www.600riders.com/forum/gara...em-wont-rev.html?highlight=pressure+regulator
Hose + clamps + gauge = reading
If you wish to do 2nd test, now you need a "T" more clamps, more hose and either a valves or some kind of restrictor.
As for the pumps check valve. With the pump submerged and a long hose attached to the outlet, if the hose is full and then moved below the pumps inlet i.e. fluid level, when the pump is off, it shouldn't siphon.
Basically we are repeating your leak test when you detach the tank from the bikes fuel rail. Does it leak or does it stop fluid travel?
Look here:
http://www.600riders.com/forum/garage-mechanical-help/55110-starts-dies-help.html
http://www.600riders.com/forum/gara...em-wont-rev.html?highlight=pressure+regulator
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Bruno1989
New Member
The pressure test I did was referring to the pressure regulator ( I think that's what it's called ) a little valve that comes out of the plastic pump housing. I used my gauge on my pump to determine if the valve was closing properly at 36psi and it was. So if it does siphon from the hose on the outlet when the pumps off the check valve is bad?
More likely it has debris in it sticking it open. But yes, if its not working its defective. But that doesnt mean it won't run you bikes engine...
It appears to do two things. Keep the pump primed and prevent siphoning.
The syringe test would be to simply apply pressure to the oulet and pull a small vacuum on the oulet. Does it hold or is it free flowing?
IMO Keeping the pump primmed is critical to its longevity while preventing sipphon may help your longevity!
PS amazon has fuel pressure test kits from $20 to $50
It appears to do two things. Keep the pump primed and prevent siphoning.
The syringe test would be to simply apply pressure to the oulet and pull a small vacuum on the oulet. Does it hold or is it free flowing?
IMO Keeping the pump primmed is critical to its longevity while preventing sipphon may help your longevity!
PS amazon has fuel pressure test kits from $20 to $50
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Bruno1989
New Member
Cleaned and reinstalled the fuel pump and reg a few times and it doesn't run out of the outlet like it did before. Still not getting any fire, not even gurgling or stumbling when I add fuel via syringe. But it's been like that since it cut off when running the only time I've ever had it running.
I pulled the fuel rail and injectors, they're working great. Shooting a nice mist
Do I need to resync throttle bodies after removing that stuff? Don't think I should just thought to ask
I can smell gas when turning the bike over w the starter.
The plug furthest to the right is the only one I can test without removing the battery and it has spark
I'm thinking I'm getting fuel and something else is wrong... But if I can't find a solution next is to buy the afore mentioned fuel pressure test gauge and go at the pump again.
I pulled the fuel rail and injectors, they're working great. Shooting a nice mist
Do I need to resync throttle bodies after removing that stuff? Don't think I should just thought to ask
I can smell gas when turning the bike over w the starter.
The plug furthest to the right is the only one I can test without removing the battery and it has spark
I'm thinking I'm getting fuel and something else is wrong... But if I can't find a solution next is to buy the afore mentioned fuel pressure test gauge and go at the pump again.
If adding fuel directly to the TB did not produce any results, ya. Look at the ignition system.
Do keep in mind that free sparks in open air really doesn't mean that the same spark plug will fire under the load of compression.
Drop the two leftside bolts from the radiator allowing it to drop a settle and plug access is simplified. They can all be done from the right side.
Also, heating the metal plug body with a propane touch bakes out some of the unburned fuel which can foul the plugs. Raising the threaded section to 300°F for 5" should do it. Of course replacement is best.
Do keep in mind that free sparks in open air really doesn't mean that the same spark plug will fire under the load of compression.
Drop the two leftside bolts from the radiator allowing it to drop a settle and plug access is simplified. They can all be done from the right side.
Also, heating the metal plug body with a propane touch bakes out some of the unburned fuel which can foul the plugs. Raising the threaded section to 300°F for 5" should do it. Of course replacement is best.
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If you smell fuel, did you have the battery fully charged and hold the throttle WIDE OPEN while cranking? If its flooded, that should clear it out...
I know you mentioned in another thread of jump starting the bike from a RUNNING TRUCK. That may caused other issues...
If you have an inductive timing light, slipping that over each plug wire while cranking is easy and should light up if you have spark(no pulling of plugs, caps etc)
I know you mentioned in another thread of jump starting the bike from a RUNNING TRUCK. That may caused other issues...
If you have an inductive timing light, slipping that over each plug wire while cranking is easy and should light up if you have spark(no pulling of plugs, caps etc)
Bruno1989
New Member
Finally got time to work on the bike again
Have spark on all 4 (just used an extra plug) Small spark without touching engine and a bright larger spark when touching engine. Consistent through all 4 plugs
Battery only reaching 12.8 when charger is hooked up ( small trickle charger )
Staying at 12.6
Terrible with diagnosing electrical and the manual isn't exactly user friendly... Any ideas as I'm out of them short of taking to a shop and getting the lube out
Have spark on all 4 (just used an extra plug) Small spark without touching engine and a bright larger spark when touching engine. Consistent through all 4 plugs
Battery only reaching 12.8 when charger is hooked up ( small trickle charger )
Staying at 12.6
Terrible with diagnosing electrical and the manual isn't exactly user friendly... Any ideas as I'm out of them short of taking to a shop and getting the lube out
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First off, ALWAYS ground (to metal) your plugs when cranking over. You shouldn't have seen any spark when NOT grounded so I dunno know about that).
Something I don't think we've touched upon and worth trying...
12.8 volts is a fully charged battery, BUT, the cranking voltage may be dropping (possibly a bad battery) and without enough volts and amps, could very well be your issue.
If you have a volt tester, see what your battery volts drop to when cranking over.
**What I would try now, jump start the bike from a GOOD, NON-RUNNING auto, automotive battery. The extra umph may be enough for enough spark, fuel system to work properly, etc.
Should you smell excess fuel, again, hold the throttle WIDE OPEN (don't close) and crank no more than 10 seconds at a time.
Good luck
Something I don't think we've touched upon and worth trying...
12.8 volts is a fully charged battery, BUT, the cranking voltage may be dropping (possibly a bad battery) and without enough volts and amps, could very well be your issue.
If you have a volt tester, see what your battery volts drop to when cranking over.
**What I would try now, jump start the bike from a GOOD, NON-RUNNING auto, automotive battery. The extra umph may be enough for enough spark, fuel system to work properly, etc.
Should you smell excess fuel, again, hold the throttle WIDE OPEN (don't close) and crank no more than 10 seconds at a time.
Good luck
Not sure how long it was on the trickle charger but it didnt reach full charge if it only made it to 12.8 volts "while charging". Now if that was the voltage hours after being removed from the charger its close. But while charging it should have peaked around 13.8 - 14.25v.
Did you replace the plugs or heat them? Also do NOT exceed the OEM gap of 0.028". If cranks at a good rate and you smell fuel/added fuel manually I'd say your plugs are fouled. Have you had the air box open? Any chance critters moved in?
Buy some new spark plugs; charge the battery more, and tell use what you are using for volt meter.
I should have paid better attention; "Just used Extra Plug"....
PLEASE remove and replace those plugs! Your life will likely improve! CR9E check/set gap at 0.027".... roughly $3.75 a plug!
PLEASE remove and replace those plugs! Your life will likely improve! CR9E check/set gap at 0.027".... roughly $3.75 a plug!
Bruno1989
New Member
I was testing the spark with an old plug but I put brand new plugs in gapped to what the manual said ( can't remember right off what it was ) when I hooked up the new battery. I am also getting 13.7-14 now while charging.
Airbox is off right now
I'm getting the readings from a 20$ Walmart tester/volt meter. ill get pics soon
Airbox is off right now
I'm getting the readings from a 20$ Walmart tester/volt meter. ill get pics soon
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Bruno1989
New Member
It's cold this morning, tried to start up w 13.6v while on charger. No luck tried 5 8-10sec holds of ign. First two no throttle ( smelled gas ) last three WO throttle. 12.7v after cranking attempts so I'm guessing the battery is good ( it's new ) and plugs are new as well
This led to me look at the eBay post I got the pump from and it's for an r6 of similar year which may be the reason it's not working (duh) but it definitely cranked and ran once with it when I first hooked up the new battery. It just ran rough then cut off after about 30secs and hasn't cranked again since. Is it possible the r6 pump is too much fuel flow/not enough ?
Was gonna pull a plug to see if they're wet but now I can't find my extension that's perfect size to get the plug out! Never a dull moment!
Found an fz6 replacement fuel pump from some other country probably going to order...
This led to me look at the eBay post I got the pump from and it's for an r6 of similar year which may be the reason it's not working (duh) but it definitely cranked and ran once with it when I first hooked up the new battery. It just ran rough then cut off after about 30secs and hasn't cranked again since. Is it possible the r6 pump is too much fuel flow/not enough ?
Was gonna pull a plug to see if they're wet but now I can't find my extension that's perfect size to get the plug out! Never a dull moment!
Found an fz6 replacement fuel pump from some other country probably going to order...
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The R6 is ~46PSI... YOU HAVE TO SWAP THE PRESSURE REGULATOR; 10psi is a lot and at idle, that extra pressure means your adding more fuel than it needs which is likely flooding it out.
After its been sitting a while, try starting it ONE time and then Disconnect power from the pump. Open the throttle about 1/2 way and it may fire off for moment.
In short you need to pull the pump and install the FZ6 P/R before the new plugs are saturated and need pulled/replaced.
After its been sitting a while, try starting it ONE time and then Disconnect power from the pump. Open the throttle about 1/2 way and it may fire off for moment.
In short you need to pull the pump and install the FZ6 P/R before the new plugs are saturated and need pulled/replaced.
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P/R is barely visible. Follow link for more info!
CLICK IMAGE for link....
CLICK IMAGE for link....
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Re the spark plug removal, if you have the stock tool kit under the seat, the plug socket works very well (believe it or not).
I think I used a box wrench on it (the OEM socket) but was able to squeeze a torque wrench in there with a combination of extensions, etc, ALL from the right side (W/O pulling the radiator) for re-installation.
Sounds like the fuel pump issue will be sorted out too!
