Code 46 and my first bike breakdown

[TownsendsFJR1300]

As for the idle, once warm, it's about 1000rpm. I started to tweak the idle screw, but I ended up hearing a bit of clattering as idle increased. I left it at about 1100 rpm for now.

It looked like 1,000 and at that idle, you WEREN'T CHARGING, you were below 12.8 volts, running off the battery.

That idle has to be high enough to NOT draw from the battery WHEN RUNNING is the bottom line.


BTW, I prefer my idle lower too but raised it just enough, just to keep a slight charge when running. Also remember, if in heavy traffic and the fan kicks on, its also pulling more current..

 

[nthdegreeburns]

I'm not sure if this improved or not. I probably didn't let it warm up enough when recording this, but you'll see the higher idle RPMs -- about 1250rpm:

[vimeo]103643535[/vimeo]

LOL the leads to the harness under the seat would pop out at higher RPMs. Revving would vibrate the frame enough to jiggle them out.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

I'm not sure if this improved or not. I probably didn't let it warm up enough when recording this, but you'll see the higher idle RPMs -- about 1250rpm:

[vimeo]103643535[/vimeo]

LOL the leads to the harness under the seat would pop out at higher RPMs. Revving would vibrate the frame enough to jiggle them out.

Yep, your idle is high enough. You should be putting out a little bit more than that IMO. Your just beyond breaking even (which is good) and we both have the BD43 mod...
Mine is putting out bout the same at a lesser RPM. Yours at 1250 is about the same as mine at 1,000 RPM's..

If you can, (don't have to record it), run the engine up to 5k until the volt meter levels out(shouldn't be 5-8 seconds) and see what its putting out. It should be around 14 volts...

[MENTION=2579]Motogiro[/MENTION] Cliff?? Marco!

 

[FinalImpact]

Yep, your idle is high enough. You should be putting out a little bit more than that IMO. Your just beyond breaking even (which is good) and we both have the BD43 mod...
Mine is putting out bout the same at a lesser RPM. Yours at 1250 is about the same as mine at 1,000 RPM's..

If you can, (don't have to record it), run the engine up to 5k until the volt meter levels out(shouldn't be 5-8 seconds) and see what its putting out. It should be around 14 volts...

[MENTION=2579]Motogiro[/MENTION] Cliff?? Marco!

As I've stated before, without knowing the depth of charge on two batteries its impossible to compare at that ^^ level. +/- 0.5V reasonable. Adding in they're temperature sensitive too..

IIRC yours was reading all low until you sucked it down and recharged it. Thus bringing it up a full 0.5v or so...

In short if a spirited 1hr ride results in a 12.7v state of charge, id be disconnecting the bike and charging it over night. Or drain it to 10.5 volts and charge at 1.5A for 5hrs and then top it off over night.

 

[Motogiro]

All good stuff and remember. We for the most part are never testing what the output is in amperes. The voltage measurements are great except for the fact that when the internal battery resistance is low it will load the charging system and the voltages will be lower. As Randy pointed out the different charged states of different batteries will show different voltage readings when the system is charging. This is natural and as the battery charges the internal battery resistance becomes greater, the load lessens and the voltage will climb. All in all the voltage references are good primary indicators but always keep in mind that without knowing the condition of all the component we have a less sure picture of charging system health. Knowing current and voltage of the charging system along with load testing the battery will give us the more accurate indication on the charging system health.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

All good stuff and remember. We for the most part are never testing what the output is in amperes. The voltage measurements are great except for the fact that when the internal battery resistance is low it will load the charging system and the voltages will be lower. As Randy pointed out the different charged states of different batteries will show different voltage readings when the system is charging. This is natural and as the battery charges the internal battery resistance becomes greater, the load lessens and the voltage will climb. All in all the voltage references are good primary indicators but always keep in mind that without knowing the condition of all the component we have a less sure picture of charging system health. Knowing current and voltage of the charging system along with load testing the battery will give us the more accurate indication on the charging system health.

Agreed however, would it not make a difference (at the voltmeter), BUT he's taking his voltages at the VR, NOT at the battery.

He has a newish battery (how charged I don't know).

Shouldn't you be getting accurate charging #'s there (at the regulator) even if the battery was low??

He's not at the battery in the video..

 

[Motogiro]

Agreed however, would it not make a difference (at the voltmeter), BUT he's taking his voltages at the VR, NOT at the battery.

He has a newish battery (how charged I don't know).

Shouldn't you be getting accurate charging #'s there (at the regulator) even if the battery was low??

He's not at the battery in the video..

If there was some type of bad connection between the regulator and battery you would get a larger difference but since you're doing a voltage test that does not load the system the difference would be very small between the battery and the regulator. Especially at the regulator. That wire is the supply wire for the output of the charging system and is the closest voltage to the battery terminals.

Try this. Measure your standing voltage at the battery and then at the regulator. They should be very close. Same if it's running.

Most of the voltages we are working with are nominal voltages, meaning, because meters can have different accuracy and component may have different quality or slightly different output, we can all show different numbers. The better technology gets with purity in semiconductors the closer we'll all be in our numbers. When we were all using analog meters there were no tenth of a volt considerations unless you were using lab type equipment that was constantly calibrated against standards references.

So in short, Yes, the rr plug is okay to get an accurate, very close, reading as would be at the battery for most of our trouble shooting needs.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

If there was some type of bad connection between the regulator and battery you would get a larger difference but since you're doing a voltage test that does not load the system the difference would be very small between the battery and the regulator. Especially at the regulator. That wire is the supply wire for the output of the charging system and is the closest voltage to the battery terminals.

Try this. Measure your standing voltage at the battery and then at the regulator. They should be very close. Same if it's running.

Most of the voltages we are working with are nominal voltages, meaning, because meters can have different accuracy and component may have different quality or slightly different output, we can all show different numbers. The better technology gets with purity in semiconductors the closer we'll all be in our numbers. When we were all using analog meters there were no tenth of a volt considerations unless you were using lab type equipment that was constantly calibrated against standards references.

So in short, Yes, the rr plug is okay to get an accurate, very close, reading as would be at the battery for most of our trouble shooting needs.

What I was trying to get at, in his video, at 1300 RPM's (Idle) or so, measured at the VR, he's not even getting 12.8 volts.. Mines in the low 13's with an old battery at 1,300..(Not discharging)

To my knowledge, that's too low, he should at least be getting that and then slightly more. Does that sound normal /acceptable to you? Or???

 

[Motogiro]

What I was trying to get at, in his video, at 1300 RPM's (Idle) or so, measured at the VR, he's not even getting 12.8 volts.. Mines in the low 13's with an old battery at 1,300..(Not discharging)

To my knowledge, that's too low, he should at least be getting that and then slightly more. Does that sound normal /acceptable to you? Or???

He's using a Centech 5 dollar and sometimes free from Harbor freight DVM. We might be using Flukes. Not saying the Centech is that much different a reading but it could be. The video is a little short and depending what condition the battery is in it might eventually show the 13 plus volts at idle, hopefully finish off above 14 vdc above idle that we like to see. His battery could be sulphated and may not come up to voltage any more. Instead it would turn the charge into wasted heat. I would in his case charge and load test the battery. Then test the RR and stator. These are pretty simple tests.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Yep, I asked for a highest voltage @ 5k (letting the voltage even out). Not sure if you read it or not, but the battery in an OEM about 3 months old.

His initial issue was popping a code for low voltage But his idle was set low (I think 1,000 or 1,100).

 

[Motogiro]

Yep, I asked for a highest voltage @ 5k (letting the voltage even out). Not sure if you read it or not, but the battery in an OEM about 3 months old.

His initial issue was popping a code for low voltage But his idle was set low (I think 1,000 or 1,100).

Yes I saw that you asked him for a little more info via RPM. Sometimes I read really fast and miss stuff but I'm sure he'll come back and read this if he's still having problems. Unfortunately even new batteries can fail prematurely...

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Unfortunately even new batteries can fail prematurely...

Yep, I mentioned that earlier too.

 

[nthdegreeburns]

Updating for the folks who were being so helpful here earlier last week. Weather got bad hot and humid -- enough to keep me from riding in Atlanta traffic. Also, head cold for 7 days. I can't afford to sneeze in an Arai...

Anyway -- took some more readings from the VDC / VR while I changed my oil today. Since the last video / post, I've only ridden 3 times, and I've been using only the higher idle speed as a possible fix for e low voltage situation I ran into the other week. No battery tender since then, just to see if the idle was helping.

Here's today's readings after starting from cold... (as cold as it was today in Hotlanta)

[vimeo]104875245[/vimeo]

Much better than the last video, especially since the probes didn't vibrate out of the VR / VDC.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Updating for the folks who were being so helpful here earlier last week. Weather got bad hot and humid -- enough to keep me from riding in Atlanta traffic. Also, head cold for 7 days. I can't afford to sneeze in an Arai...

Anyway -- took some more readings from the VDC / VR while I changed my oil today. Since the last video / post, I've only ridden 3 times, and I've been using only the higher idle speed as a possible fix for e low voltage situation I ran into the other week. No battery tender since then, just to see if the idle was helping.

Here's today's readings after starting from cold... (as cold as it was today in Hotlanta)

[vimeo]104875245[/vimeo]

Much better than the last video, especially since the probes didn't vibrate out of the VR / VDC.

Glad you feeling better!

Agreed, your charging system is fine at low, cold idle.

Do you have an SAE battery charger cable sticking out on the bike anywhere?

What I did when checking mine was bungee the meter onto the left side of the fairing and "plugged" into my BMW style outlet with alligator clips. (Rags around the fairing to prevent damage/scratchs). Then while underway, you can see what voltages your getting from the battery.

My failing battery shows a lower voltage (not a lot, not yet at least) than at the VR, so you may want to check that. If the newish battery isn't accepting the full charge for some reason (and your system is indeed charging) this will show voltage going in, coming out etc.

Just make sure you hot idle voltage at the battery is at least 13 volts to keep from popping a code and also getting a dead battery...

 

[nthdegreeburns]

ROFL -- I do have an SAE Connector and SAE to alligator clips adapter. I could chuck the meter and clips into my tank bag and check when stopped.

 

[FinalImpact]

Do note that when voltage readings are not the same from point to point it implies there is resistance at the location w the lower voltage. Resistance in the form of a bad connection induces voltage drop and/or current loss.
The meter is not a load compared to say a small lamp. Point: if a load is applied (like a lamp) and the various destinations are supposed to be able to carry say a 5Amp load, a compromised connection will show up as voltage drop when doing voltage comparisons.

I'm saying battery and RR should be within 0.1vdc or you have a compromised connection.