Congrats USA with your new president!

[Mattberkshire]

The english government has been creeping socialism into society for a number of years and the credit crunch has them rubbing their greasy palms in glee at the prospect of the businesses they can nationalise. Trouble is the socialism Gordon Brown believes in is all about controlling peoples lives in minute detail, telling you what you can and can't do whilst NOT improving public services. They spend a fortune on irrelevant public sector jobs, they introduce irrelevant tests in schools, it's all about control control control and then they spend billions bailing out the banks. I would like to see half of them (the banks) go bust then the rest would sh*t themselves and get their houses in order.

The UK government is corrupt, self serving, incompetent and useless. And socialist

 

[Gilo-FZ6]

Regarding the job situation in the US..i saw on the news the other day that in 2009 a projected 80% of all eastern european immigrant workers will go to the States and Canada..they are already leaving in droves here in the UK due to the problems we've had in our economy..waiters/resses,builders,plumbers and many other trades..these people work any hours for any wage..and they nearly always send the money back home ,so it wont be circulating

 

[Capo79]

The english government has been creeping socialism into society for a number of years and the credit crunch has them rubbing their greasy palms in glee at the prospect of the businesses they can nationalise. Trouble is the socialism Gordon Brown believes in is all about controlling peoples lives in minute detail, telling you what you can and can't do whilst NOT improving public services. They spend a fortune on irrelevant public sector jobs, they introduce irrelevant tests in schools, it's all about control control control and then they spend billions bailing out the banks. I would like to see half of them (the banks) go bust then the rest would sh*t themselves and get their houses in order.

The UK government is corrupt, self serving, incompetent and useless. And socialist

I really don't think you can blame what ever degree of socialism you may or may not have, on the very non-socialist banks that have tried to make fast money out of not so fortunate house owners... Remember that several UK banks have been VERY present on Wall street.

Another aspect to the equation: What part of the british industry is actually good or prosperous, or actually deserve to see the light of day? Except for the banks, I mean... The car industry is sh¤te (and sold to India). I can't actually think of another european country with that little innovation as the UK. I could bet plenty much that this definately has something to do with it.

 

[FZyLarry]

I am going to be optimistic about where our country is going not because I am a left leaning liberal but because I truly think Mr. Obama is interested in making things better. Also I think we can be creating a self fulfilling prophecy with pessimism so I try to avoid it.

I agree with what many others in this thread have said, I don't like to see "big government" because I think it gains it's own momentum and stifles creativity and entrepreneurship. However, I think that greed and a lack of accepting personal responsibility have taken this country so far down the wrong road that we need to have government regulation and oversight to bring things back into control - hopefully the same scoundrels that stole our money while in the public sector don't become the scoundrels that steal our money in the government sector.

Lastly, I think GW Bush made so many bad foreign policy decisions that we look like the big oppressive bully to the rest of the world. After September 11th we could have taken advantage of the sympathy shown to us by the rest of the world to really improve our world image. Instead we squandered it in Iraq. Now more of the world holds a deepening hatred for us and THAT is what increases our security threats.

By the way, thanks to all of the EU forum members who have voiced congratulations and words of encouragement. Maybe four years from now things will be looking brighter. :thumbup:

 

[wrightme43]

A wise and frugal government, which shall leave men free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor and bread it has earned - this is the sum of good government.
Thomas Jefferson


Experience demands that man is the only animal which devours his own kind, for I can apply no milder term to the general prey of the rich on the poor.
Thomas Jefferson

I own that I am not a friend to a very energetic government. It is always oppressive.
Thomas Jefferson

I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them.
Thomas Jefferson

The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.
Thomas Jefferson

Thats about all I feel the need to say. Well that and I moved this to the politics thread so it doesnt have to be deleted.

 

[FZ1inNH]

I'll simply stay ON TOPIC and Thank Capo79 for his gracious congrats to America.

Now, to join the other topic of the thread: I'm VERY happy with the new President and no, he's not going to fix everything. This is a bigger mess than one man, one congress, and one term. What I will say is he's off to the BEST possible start by fixing the CAUSE of the problem and shipping him back to Texas where he should have stayed.

DISCLAIMER: This is my opinion. I don't care if it doesn't sit well with others because I'm not asking anyone to SHARE my opinion. Also, no comments on my opinion will change it.

 

[Fz6Sa]

I'll simply stay ON TOPIC and Thank Capo79 for his gracious congrats to America.

Now, to join the other topic of the thread: I'm VERY happy with the new President and no, he's not going to fix everything. This is a bigger mess than one man, one congress, and one term. What I will say is he's off to the BEST possible start by fixing the CAUSE of the problem and shipping him back to Texas where he should have stayed.

DISCLAIMER: This is my opinion. I don't care if it doesn't sit well with others because I'm not asking anyone to SHARE my opinion. Also, no comments on my opinion will change it.

You do realise that the only way for the world to get out of the current mess is for people to STOP saying "no comments on my opinion will change it." .......

 

[dako81]

You do realise that the only way for the world to get out of the current mess is for people to STOP saying "no comments on my opinion will change it." .......

I agree.

I must type more for it to let me post.

 

[necrotimus]

A wise and frugal government, which shall leave men free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor and bread it has earned - this is the sum of good government.
Thomas Jefferson


Experience demands that man is the only animal which devours his own kind, for I can apply no milder term to the general prey of the rich on the poor.
Thomas Jefferson

I own that I am not a friend to a very energetic government. It is always oppressive.
Thomas Jefferson

I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them.
Thomas Jefferson

The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.
Thomas Jefferson

Thats about all I feel the need to say. Well that and I moved this to the politics thread so it doesnt have to be deleted.

I agree with this 100%. But I also believe the economy is just waiting for the next big thing. To vastly simplify the last few big things I will just say industry, car, internet. We are now past the industrial age. The car companies have been behind other countries way too long. The internet has been outsourced to India. I do not think the proposed social programs will fix the country. Some of them are good ideas and some of them are a waste of money. Ultimately I believe it will be a technology or science that puts the economy right.

In either case I hope the best for any and all Presidents of the US even if they are filthy politicians.

 

[FZ1inNH]

You do realise that the only way for the world to get out of the current mess is for people to STOP saying "no comments on my opinion will change it." .......

That's only an opinion. It is neither right nor wrong. It has nothing to do with the mess we are in which is based on more facts than we can list here in the forum collectively.

The fact that enough people had their "opinion" and voted for a change rather than extend Bush's politics ANOTHER 4 years is EXACTLY why we'll end up getting out of this mess.

Thus, three cheers for a non-changed opinion! :cheer: :cheer: :cheer:

 

[Fz6Sa]

That's only an opinion. It is neither right nor wrong. It has nothing to do with the mess we are in which is based on more facts than we can list here in the forum collectively.

The fact that enough people had their "opinion" and voted for a change rather than extend Bush's politics ANOTHER 4 years is EXACTLY why we'll end up getting out of this mess.

Thus, three cheers for a non-changed opinion! :cheer: :cheer: :cheer:

So; you agree that changing your opinion can make the world a better place?
(Thanks for proving my point )

 

[FZ1inNH]

So; you agree that changing your opinion can make the world a better place?
(Thanks for proving my point )

If my opinion had changed then I did prove your point, but it has not. It's just that my own opinion throughout this process has remained constant and I'm ever more thankful that so many others shared the same opinion.

But, yes, you are partially correct. If everyone's opinion changes, it would change the world. The debate is definitely out about it being a better place afterward though. That would depend on what the majority opinion changed.

The other point I will make is that I stick to my opinions and it is rare that my opnion changes based on what someone tells me. To change my opinion, I need hard, cold facts. Yes, I am hard-headed but I consider myself to be genuine because my opinions are typically based on what is good for all others and not solely to benefit myself. For the good of the people, if you will. In my opinion, McCain did not fit this description. Obama did. :thumbup:

 

[wrightme43]

Interesting to see that you think your family member has phenomenal benefits... At the moment I'm in paternity leave on the sixth and last week of it. My wife had her maternity leave since 1st of february 2008 until I took over in mid December. In other words, getting a kid here, means either 47 weeks of total leave with 100% salary, or 54 weeks with 80% salary. Six weeks of them are especially for the father. The employer pays you, but gets it refunded by the government.

There's full kindergarden coverage throughout the country, which is great of course. We don't have to worry about not getting a spot. Still, despite that, we don't have to pay more than 200 bucks a month for it.

Furthermore, we have 5 weeks of vacation time every year. Nothing less. People retire at the age of 65 with a pension of 67% of the average income the last few years of work life before retirement (you can of course have your own, private pension plan on the side). We get paid if we should become unemployed, yet the unemployment rate is 2% at the moment. It might go up to 3-4% the next year or so, but still. One might think that people want to get unemployed, but empirically, that's not the case.

One might wonder how a nation can afford this? Well... We pay an income tax of roughly 35-40% (but still have the best purchasing power in the world, maybe except for the Swiss) The more you make, the more you'll likely have to pay. We have a so called pension fund, which is an investment fund governed by the federal reserve. I think the total balance of that now is something like 1500 billion NOK, or 250-300 billion $. That's 50.000 $ for each Norwegian. No more than 4% of the expected returns from the fund each year, will be taken into account to the public expenditure budget. This means that we have a huge reserve that we CAN use if things are going bad.

I really don't see what's wrong with socialism, especially when considering that we can buy all the similar services that US citizens HAVE to pay to survive. But we don't have to. If it's possible for America to adopt only a fraction of this, I'd be happy for you.

All I wish now, is that the weather gets a little warmer:thumbup:

Now this is not a attack on you. This is a statement of a fact that was left out and is really really really really important to the ability of Norway to provide the services you recieve. You are the Third largest oil exporting country in the world. With out this income the social systems you spoke of will collapse. It is not possible to do what your country is doing with out this money.
Socialism can work for a while in that enviroment. Not forever.

 

[wrightme43]

Obama recieved 52% of the popular vote. This is not in anyway to be taken as a huge vote of confidence in his policy of "CHANGE"tm.

Bush had 50.7% in 2004, either this was a overwhelming vote as well or niether one of them were.

Just because you agree does not in anyway make a overwhelming vindication of your opinions.


I think that he is a lying pandering scumball who will along with a democrat led majority in the house and senate cause almost certain long term damage to our rights, freedoms, and welfare. I believe they will horribley damage our ability to protect our country, and do everything in their power to degrade the ability of the american citizen to defend themselves from the over reaching hand of government.

These are my opinons. I came to these conclusions after much research. I am more than able to back them up with actual facts.

Change is not a policy. Change as it was stated is anything you want to believe it to be.

 

[DecepticonDon]

"SOME writers have so confounded society with government, as to leave little or no distinction between them; whereas they are not only different, but have different origins. Society is produced by our wants, and government by our wickedness; the former promotes our happiness POSITIVELY by uniting our affections, the latter NEGATIVELY by restraining our vices. The one encourages intercourse, the other creates distinctions. The first is a patron, the last a punisher.

"Society in every state is a blessing, but Government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one: for when we suffer, or are exposed to the same miseries BY A GOVERNMENT, which we might expect in a country WITHOUT GOVERNMENT, our calamity is heightened by reflecting that we furnish the means by which we suffer. Government, like dress, is the badge of lost innocence; the palaces of kings are built upon the ruins of the bowers of paradise. For were the impulses of conscience clear, uniform and irresistibly obeyed, man would need no other lawgiver; but that not being the case, he finds it necessary to surrender up a part of his property to furnish means for the protection of the rest; and this he is induced to do by the same prudence which in every other case advises him, out of two evils to choose the least. Wherefore, security being the true design and end of government, it unanswerably follows that whatever form thereof appears most likely to ensure it to us, with the least expense and greatest benefit, is preferable to all others."
"I draw my idea of the form of government from a principle in nature which no art can overturn, viz. that the more simple any thing is, the less liable it is to be disordered, and the easier repaired when disordered"

Thomas Paine Common Sense

This seems the opposite of what is now and what is to come.
All politicians are $hit.
If you buy into this "change", you have now become an Obamazombie.

 

[Red Wazp]

This seems the opposite of what is now and what is to come.
All politicians are $hit.
If you buy into this "change", you have now become an Obamazombie.[/QUOTE]



+1

 

[Silverback]

Two things stand out for me, both quite IRONIC, first a Black man occupying the White House, and secondly the transition from Texas Redneck to African American couldn't really be further apart on the scale of American society...I guess people really were sick of the OLD established political dynasties and worn stereotypes...Good luck Obama, George.w. left you one hell of a mess to clean up....