Dual H4 mod gone wrong; Help!

[Water Bear]

Hello everyone!

I tried installing a dual H4 mod and the lights are acting weird. I realize that I didn't know enough about what I was doing to attempt this. Water under the bridge now. Here's the deets:

I bought a 100 watt power relay that plugs into the stock H4 plug coming from the fairing. The relay itself then splits that into two H4 female plugs that go to the headlights. I cut the back plate on a regular H4 to fit the H7 slot on the left (from the drivers seat).

So now when I turn the bike on, the lights aren't on. Then when I flip the switch to high beams, both low beams come on. If I instead plug the power relay into the factory male plug for the H7 bulb, both low beams are on when the switch is set to low, but flipping to high beam does nothing - both lows stay on with no apparent change in the light.

Even more fun: If I put both factory plugs directly into both H4 bulbs, the left eye is always on set to low beam, and the right eye is dark. If I flip the switch to high beam, the right eye comes on set to low beam.

What have I done? Can this situation be salvaged or is it back to stock? (Also why does the H7 bulb I took out of my bike months ago not fit the factory plug on the left eye)?

The world is a confusing place.

 

[Motogiro]

Please give a schematic/instruction of the system your using. Is the relay assembly your using made specifically for the FZ6? The FZ6 made for the US does not have the proper switching for H4 headlamp configuration. If this assembly you installed does not provide the proper swithcing you may have a problem. The headlight signal voltage Low beam, comes from black with a green tracer wire, This wire only becomes active after the engine has been started.
It would be hard to give an answer without first knowing if the assembly is designed for the FZ6 because it does not have conventional H4 headlamp switching if the bike was not a single headlamp designed for the naked version. Please give more info on your setup.

 

[Water Bear]

I will do some more research tomorrow after I've had some sleep. Thanks for your reply!!

The kit is from H4 Kits.

It is the so called "H4 Dual Headlight Relay Kit." It is NOT intended for the Fz6. My bike is an electrically stock 2007 fz6. Only electrical "mod" so far was installing this kit and bludgeoning an H4 bulb into the H7 socket.

 

[Water Bear]

OK, I bought an H4 plug I can use to re-arrange what wire goes where. I found your reply here: http://www.600riders.com/forum/fz6-electrical/52884-headlight-wiring.html?highlight=headlight+wiring+diagram about what wire does what on the factory Fz6 plug. I am searching for a resource that explains what the wires are for the standard H4 bulb and have not found anything I'm sure of yet. Any guidance on that would be appreciated.

Thanks again for your help Motogiro!

Edit: Is this correct? http://www.easternbeaver.com/Main/H4_socket_wiring2.jpg

 

[Water Bear]

IT WORKS!

Thank you so much for the info, Motogiro!! All I needed, it seems, was to know that the wiring pattern was different. I realize that link i provided was for my own harness (which actually was an accident ) so it and your previous post was all I needed.

Thanks a million!

 

[FinalImpact]

I guess the question is, what do you know about the relay?
Some use 2 poles to energize (gnd & +12), then may have 1, 2, or 3 poles that do the actual work.

The added hitch is the OEM harness (method) powers the BLK/GRN trace all the time (engine running) and you can't do this to your H4 bulbs as ends up energizing both low and high beam elements at the same time if you don't switch it properly.

At a glance your relay needs to be SPDT (single pole, double throw) and use the High beam lead from the FZ BLK/YLW trace as the trigger.

What this means is your relay will need to be configured such that its off state (no input from FZ HB ) has an output which powers the LB elements (think pass through) as the FZ ecu will power the circuit when the engine is running.
When switched HB active, the LB output turns off and the relays other pole turns to power the HB elements.

HB element spade is across from the Ground Spade while the low beam spade is the center spade.

Tell us who made the relay, what model it is and if it has diagram on it. One of can sketch you a diagram.

 

[Motogiro]

The FZ6 (made for US.) headlamp system does not have the correct switching to use for a combined H4 lamp set up. Although there is an H4 on the bike it only uses the filament for high beam application and does not use the low beam filament in the lamp. This means one eye on the FZ6 was for low beam and the other was the for high beam. A way around that is to modify the wiring either by relay or an added wire in the harness that will supply the low beam but shut off the low beam filament when the high beam is activated. This allows for light in each eye while retaining the high beam.
You could just buss over the low beam voltage from the low beam H7 lamp to the H4 low beam filament lamp but when high beam filament is activated the H4 dual filament lamp it will overheat if both filaments remain burning in the lamp at the same time. So the H4 lamp is designed to have only 1 of it's 2 filaments burning at a time.

The system that you bought may do this switching for you. You will have to wire it correctly and test it to see that the low beam filaments shut off when the high beam is activated. If not, your dual headlamp H4 setup with fail (overheat) pretty quickly and you will be drawing a total of approximately 230 watts for just your headlamps.

One other fact is although you've added the filaments in each eye the reflectors were designed strictly for the original light filaments for the OEM set up. This means the the performance of the lighting in each eye may be improved by re aiming the headlamps.

The black with green wire in the H7 plug is attached to a flag connector that can be removed from the H7 plug and inserted in the remaining unused slot in the H4 headlamp plug, Now you can see if the relay system you've installed works correctly.
Remember you must start the engine for the headlamps to come on!

 

[Water Bear]

The FZ6 (made for US.) headlamp system does not have the correct switching to use for a combined H4 lamp set up. Although there is an H4 on the bike it only uses the filament for high beam application and does not use the low beam filament in the lamp. This means one eye on the FZ6 was for low beam and the other was the for high beam. A way around that is to modify the wiring either by relay or an added wire in the harness that will supply the low beam but shut off the low beam filament when the high beam is activated. This allows for light in each eye while retaining the high beam.
You could just buss over the low beam voltage from the low beam H7 lamp to the H4 low beam filament lamp but when high beam filament is activated the H4 dual filament lamp it will overheat if both filaments remain burning in the lamp at the same time. So the H4 lamp is designed to have only 1 of it's 2 filaments burning at a time.

The system that you bought may do this switching for you. You will have to wire it correctly and test it to see that the low beam filaments shut off when the high beam is activated. If not, your dual headlamp H4 setup with fail (overheat) pretty quickly and you will be drawing a total of approximately 230 watts for just your headlamps.

One other fact is although you've added the filaments in each eye the reflectors were designed strictly for the original light filaments for the OEM set up. This means the the performance of the lighting in each eye may be improved by re aiming the headlamps.

The black with green wire in the H7 plug is attached to a flag connector that can be removed from the H7 plug and inserted in the remaining unused slot in the H4 headlamp plug, Now you can see if the relay system you've installed works correctly.
Remember you must start the engine for the headlamps to come on!

The way I've got it now, I have a single plug hooked up to both the factory plugs. That single plug then provides signal to the after market relay.

I will have to check and see if both filaments are on when I switch to high beam. Is there an easy way to do this without blinding myself? Either way I can at least drive around like this for the time being since the low beams work properly.

 

[Motogiro]

Interesting that I didn't see some of the previous posts today before I answered with the additional info. When I need to look at the sun I use welding goggles. You can get em cheap at harbor freight...

Sent from Moto's Motorola

 

[Water Bear]

Interesting that I didn't see some of the previous posts today before I answered with the additional info. When I need to look at the sun I use welding goggles. You can get em cheap at harbor freight...

Sent from Moto's Motorola

Yea, I noticed that. Forum weirdness.

I discovered, by total luck, that when the bike is <10 feet from a wall you can just look and see if the low beams go off when the highs come on. Sadly...they do not in my case. So...I need to make a switch!

 

[Water Bear]

I guess the question is, what do you know about the relay?
Some use 2 poles to energize (gnd & +12), then may have 1, 2, or 3 poles that do the actual work.

The added hitch is the OEM harness (method) powers the BLK/GRN trace all the time (engine running) and you can't do this to your H4 bulbs as ends up energizing both low and high beam elements at the same time if you don't switch it properly.

At a glance your relay needs to be SPDT (single pole, double throw) and use the High beam lead from the FZ BLK/YLW trace as the trigger.

What this means is your relay will need to be configured such that its off state (no input from FZ HB ) has an output which powers the LB elements (think pass through) as the FZ ecu will power the circuit when the engine is running.
When switched HB active, the LB output turns off and the relays other pole turns to power the HB elements.

HB element spade is across from the Ground Spade while the low beam spade is the center spade.

Tell us who made the relay, what model it is and if it has diagram on it. One of can sketch you a diagram.

Thanks for the help! It was made by Eastern Beaver on over at H4 Kits.

At the bottom of the following page is a diagram, but it's pretty darn straight forward, I'm afraid. Installation

At this point I need to manufacture a switch like the one you described. I have no experience here and my knowledge of circuits was never that good. Edit: If it's possible to do using parts from Radio Shack and without welding, I might be able to...

Double Edit: The wiring diagram at the bottom of that page is for the single H4 harness, mine looks similar but has two H4 plugs.

 

[FinalImpact]

If it were mine, tap into the OEM high beam output and use that to trigger your relay.
The SPDT relay would then do the switching for you!
Look up the BD43 dual head light mod on this forum, you tap into that and you're set.

The relay is common and has a single input (30) that switches between 87 and 87A.
You simply connect your low beam to the output 87 or 87A (not sure which is the pass through) to the output that is powered when the HB is off.
30 would be the cureent FZ low beam power as it is on any time the engine is running.

 

[Water Bear]

If it were mine, tap into the OEM high beam output and use that to trigger your relay.
The SPDT relay would then do the switching for you!
Look up the BD43 dual head light mod on this forum, you tap into that and you're set.

The relay is common and has a single input (30) that switches between 87 and 87A.
You simply connect your low beam to the output 87 or 87A (not sure which is the pass through) to the output that is powered when the HB is off.
30 would be the cureent FZ low beam power as it is on any time the engine is running.

So you use the signal from the BD43 wire as an input to the relay? I will search up the details.

 

[FinalImpact]

I don't have the schematic handy to say that oem black yellow won't work as I think it should.

Take picture of the relay you have. It is just one relay, right? How many terminals does it have and does it have a tiny drawing on it?

If the output section has 3 spades, use an ohm meter to verify there is an off state that passes through. Then power the relay and verify the other terminal gets switched. The switched one will be you HB. The pass through will be the LB. Make sense?

 

[Motogiro]

If your bike is a non modified FZ6 made for the US. the headlight wires work as follows.:

The low beam wire is black with a green tracer.
The high beam wire is black with a yellow tracer.
The low beam wire is supposed to go to zero voltage when the high beam wire is activated. On the stock US FZ6 the low beam wire does not shut off but for the standard H4 lamp that has 2 filaments the low beam wire is suppose to shut off when the high beam is active.

Your Eastern Beaver set up does not show how the relays are switching so there is no way other than you seeing the low beam staying on to know that the correctly wired Eastern Beaver relay does not compensate for this.

I would recommend getting in touch with bd43 to see if he still has the wire kit he used to make. If you can not get this wire I can still help you correct this problem so don't be discouraged.

 

[Motogiro]

I looks like your Eastern Beaver relays use the battery to power your headlights and uses the low beam and high beam wires to control whether you have the high bean on or low beam on.

Here is a schematic (attached) using a relay to convert your low beam so that it goes off. If your set up is using the original wiring as a control then you don't need a high wattage relay. Any relay that will carry 1 amp will be more than sufficient. Just follow the hookup and your new setup should run properly..

Sorry I keep calling the company Beaverton instead of Eastern Beaver but I'm going to call them and tell them to use the name I came up with for them!

 

[Water Bear]

I don't have the schematic handy to say that oem black yellow won't work as I think it should.

Take picture of the relay you have. It is just one relay, right? How many terminals does it have and does it have a tiny drawing on it?

If the output section has 3 spades, use an ohm meter to verify there is an off state that passes through. Then power the relay and verify the other terminal gets switched. The switched one will be you HB. The pass through will be the LB. Make sense?

I can't take a pic right now since I'm in a different city than the Fiz atm Otherwise I would do that. Sorry I'm not able to be more helpful :/

Unfortunately it seems to keep both HB and LB on when the HB is switched. I'm not sure (since I don't know what I'm talking about, really) but I think the relay I have just uses whatever signal the factory plugs provide. The way I've got it now:

I bought an after market female ended plug which has three loose wires poking out the back. I crimped spade connectors onto those loose wires then hooked the spade connectors up to the appropriate factory female-ended plugs coming out of my fairing, so that I was getting signal from factory low beam to the low beam input on the Eastern Beaver harness, signal from the factory high beam to the harness, etc. The result is that I have one plug attached to my after market harness that has wires going to both the factory female ended plugs for signal.

As Motogiro notes below, my after market harness draws power directly from the battery and is switched by the factory signals. Since it seems to keep both beams on when high beam is switched, I deduce that the after market harness just takes whatever signal it receives and uses that for switching, without accounting for HB and LB being on at the same time.

 

[Water Bear]

I looks like your Eastern Beaver relays use the battery to power your headlights and uses the low beam and high beam wires to control whether you have the high bean on or low beam on.

Here is a schematic (attached) using a relay to convert your low beam so that it goes off. If your set up is using the original wiring as a control then you don't need a high wattage relay. Any relay that will carry 1 amp will be more than sufficient. Just follow the hookup and your new setup should run properly..

Sorry I keep calling the company Beaverton instead of Eastern Beaver but I'm going to call them and tell them to use the name I came up with for them!

That is awesomely helpful! And you can call it whatever you want, just don't call it professionally installed.

I am not the greatest with circuits. I can see you (and FI) are putting a lot of time into answering my questions, so I hate to ask for basic explanations. But...can you provide an explanation-for-dummies about how to build (or buy) the switch you describe?

Alternatively is there a way for me to the use the BD43 wire output to achieve my goal? I guess I don't know what the BD43 wires actually does. Does it provide a low beam signal that switches off when high beams are on...?

 

[Motogiro]

That is awesomely helpful! And you can call it whatever you want, just don't call it professionally installed.

I am not the greatest with circuits. I can see you (and FI) are putting a lot of time into answering my questions, so I hate to ask for basic explanations. But...can you provide an explanation-for-dummies about how to build (or buy) the switch you describe?

Alternatively is there a way for me to the use the BD43 wire output to achieve my goal? I guess I don't know what the BD43 wires actually does. Does it provide a low beam signal that switches off when high beams are on...?

I enjoy helping out. That's the really cool thing about our forum! We have so many people in different walks of life that help each other out here. It is amazing how people like Randy and Scott offer constant technical help, support and documentation to help others.

The bd43 (a member on this forum) wire does exactly that. It provides the low beam signal that switches off on high beam. If you can't get abd43 wire I'll help you out.

 

[FinalImpact]

This is easy and relies on a relay that has an electrical path that is normaly closed when not powered. As in it conducts energy when not powered. This pass through feature will operate your low beams using the FZ low beam circuit that only comes on when the engine is started.

When the relay is powered by the FZ HB BLK/YLW, it uses the low beam input power from the FZ oem harness and switches it to the HB.... The relay used ensures both can not be on at the same time.

The relay must be able to handle two bulbs or 130watts.